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Old March 1st, 2016, 07:12 AM   #51

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I doubt about that since unlike the Catholic Spaniards in which intermarriage was so prevalent in their colonies, the Protestants would rather marry a white woman. For sure they would have consensual sex with native women but the child born out of it shall be bastards oftentimes. These colonialist who were like that were the French, the Dutch and the British that were mostly protestants.

KKK is not a phenomenon among the Catholic nations. It is only true among the Protestant territories and among its practices is hatred among the Catholics. The Irish were among their victims.
The Klan was started here in the USA by a former Confederate officer. As for intermarriage, because of the sheer # of Christians in 18th-19th century Europe and even the USA...there were at least some cases of intermarriage between Catholics and Protestants. During the US civil war, many Irish Catholics fought on the Union side...I'm sure there was discrimination against the Irish and even from the Irish...resulting in fist fighting and other forms of violence between Catholics and Protestants. For me, the KKK was a strong group and very influential during its heydays, but the clan failed in its goal of instilling fear into Catholics in general. You look at the US civil war going up to WW2...during these times you could find Catholics in powerful positions within the US gov and military. I think that the intolerant Protestants were upset with the fact that Catholics have a history of greatness. After all much of the Kingdoms of Europe were Catholic Kingdoms..the Templars and Hospitallers, they were Catholics. Most of the great Christian warriors and leaders of Europe during the middle ages were Catholics.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 09:59 AM   #52

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Amen, Joan.

General Nathan B. Forrest is generally "credited" with founding the KKK.

John B. Gordon, a former Confederate General, was later Governor of Georgia and one of the Klan leaders.
John B. Gordon (1832-1904) | New Georgia Encyclopedia

The KKK was against anyone who was not white, Anglo-Saxon, Protestant, and a member of the Democratic Party.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 10:12 AM   #53
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The Vatican is a city, a country, a business rather than a church as Protestants see a church. It was powerful too because of its reign of terror though out Europe and elsewhere.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 10:23 AM   #54

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Amen, Joan.

General Nathan B. Forrest is generally "credited" with founding the KKK.

John B. Gordon, a former Confederate General, was later Governor of Georgia and one of the Klan leaders.
John B. Gordon (1832-1904) | New Georgia Encyclopedia

The KKK was against anyone who was not white, Anglo-Saxon, Protestant, and a member of the Democratic Party.
Its interesting how things have changed isnt it. Back in the day the democratic party did include many racists..these days while I would not call the GOP party in general as racist...its GOP politicians for the most part that for example are blocking improved rights for LGBT people in the USA.

I would also contest the argument that most of the racists of the reconstruction era up until the 1960s were southerners. Interviews of African Americans who lived during the reconstruction era up until the civil rights movements during the 1960s...tell a story that racism was just as prevalent in the North as it was in the south.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 10:33 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by David Vagamundo View Post
Amen, Joan.

General Nathan B. Forrest is generally "credited" with founding the KKK.

John B. Gordon, a former Confederate General, was later Governor of Georgia and one of the Klan leaders.
John B. Gordon (1832-1904) | New Georgia Encyclopedia

The KKK was against anyone who was not white, Anglo-Saxon, Protestant, and a member of the Democratic Party.
This is not true. The Reconstruction KKK was about race and was founded at a time when blacks had political power. I just explained in this thread that the original KKK even had Jewish members.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 10:37 AM   #56

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The Vatican is a city, a country, a business rather than a church as Protestants see a church. It was powerful too because of its reign of terror though out Europe and elsewhere.
You mean to say though that some Protestants see the Catholic Church as a business. Fact is that today there are many cases of intermarriage between Protestants and Catholics, even marriage between Christians and Atheists occur these days. The Catholic Church has a 2000 year history, and its teachings are based on the teachings of Christianity. So when you say things like the Church went on a reign of terror, I would disagree with this and IMO suggesting that the Church went on a reign of terror is like saying Jesus Christ is a terrorist.

Catholic means Universal. The Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ. Saint Peter, one of the Twelve apostles, was the first Pope of the Catholic Church. Now as has been said, not all Christians agree that Saint Peter was the first Pope of the Church....I get that. That being said the Church follows the teachings of Jesus Christ...now these teachings can not be changed. The Protestant reformation by its own definition...was a reformation...these were folks trying to reform Christianity. And look at what happened because of this new religion called Protestantism ...some Protestant leaders sought to crush the Catholic Church and these Protestant leaders failed. Why any Protestants or evangelicals of today would be against the Church is a surprise to me.

Many of the Christian heroes of Europe were Catholic...so I think that any Evangelical or Protestant Christian that claims to respect European history or even claims to respect their own European ancestors....will by default have to respect the Catholic Church. Pretty much all Americans of Euro descent or Europeans of today are going to have Catholic ancestors. An American Protestant who is critical of the Catholic Church is also being critical of their own ancestors.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 10:41 AM   #57

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This is not true. The Reconstruction KKK was about race and was founded at a time when blacks had political power. I just explained in this thread that the original KKK even had Jewish members.
Well I have read that the CSA employed Jews...one of the most notable being Judah P Benjamin. The historian and former US politician, David Duke...claims that Mr Benjamin stole money from the CSA and was in part responsible for the CSA's failure to win the US civil war. Now when it comes to this claim that Benjamin stole money from the CSA...I have only heard this from Mr Duke, and Mr Duke is a man of controversy.

Going by the fact that Judah P Benjamin was a major part of the CSA...I could see some Jewish members of the Klan of the reconstruction era.. but as for the 1920s...one would be very hard pressed to find Jewish members of the KKK.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 11:07 AM   #58

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Its interesting how things have changed isnt it. Back in the day the democratic party did include many racists..these days while I would not call the GOP party in general as racist...its GOP politicians for the most part that for example are blocking improved rights for LGBT people in the USA.

I would also contest the argument that most of the racists of the reconstruction era up until the 1960s were southerners. Interviews of African Americans who lived during the reconstruction era up until the civil rights movements during the 1960s...tell a story that racism was just as prevalent in the North as it was in the south.
I was agreeing with you, Joan. Please don't pick an argument with me.

Agree with you about where racists lived (and still live), but I never said anything about that. Based on my own experience, white northerners are at least as racist as southerners today.

However, racists in the south were firmly in control of the Democratic Party, which was firmly in control of the state legislatures (and had enough votes in the US Congress to prevent enacting Civil Rights laws that would have resulted in loss of that control) which gave their racism the backing of the law (i.e. de jure racism).

Last edited by David Vagamundo; March 1st, 2016 at 11:17 AM.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 11:07 AM   #59
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You mean to say though that some Protestants see the Catholic Church as a business. Fact is that today there are many cases of intermarriage between Protestants and Catholics, even marriage between Christians and Atheists occur these days. The Catholic Church has a 2000 year history, and its teachings are based on the teachings of Christianity. So when you say things like the Church went on a reign of terror, I would disagree with this and IMO suggesting that the Church went on a reign of terror is like saying Jesus Christ is a terrorist.

Catholic means Universal. The Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ. Saint Peter, one of the Twelve apostles, was the first Pope of the Catholic Church. Now as has been said, not all Christians agree that Saint Peter was the first Pope of the Church....I get that. That being said the Church follows the teachings of Jesus Christ...now these teachings can not be changed. The Protestant reformation by its own definition...was a reformation...these were folks trying to reform Christianity. And look at what happened because of this new religion called Protestantism ...some Protestant leaders sought to crush the Catholic Church and these Protestant leaders failed. Why any Protestants or evangelicals of today would be against the Church is a surprise to me.

Many of the Christian heroes of Europe were Catholic...so I think that any Evangelical or Protestant Christian that claims to respect European history or even claims to respect their own European ancestors....will by default have to respect the Catholic Church. Pretty much all Americans of Euro descent or Europeans of today are going to have Catholic ancestors. An American Protestant who is critical of the Catholic Church is also being critical of their own ancestors.
I don't agree that Jesus founded the RC church. I look at the RC church and see pomp and grandeur. Christ said he had not a place to lay down his head. He was born in a stable and was a carpenter. Compare that with Rome and its popes,bishops,cardinals etc.

Yes, Protestants were once RCs but they choose to break away because they saw what was going on in it. Many of them paid the supreme penalty for breaking from Rome....death.

Rome saw religion as a better way to control people without the cost in money and men. It has worked. Rome has probably been responsible for more deaths than Hitler.
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Old March 1st, 2016, 11:19 AM   #60

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. . . . Rome has probably been responsible for more deaths than Hitler.
Although this is off topic, I'd be interested in seeing a separate thread that provides support for this statement.
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