Martin Luther King Jr. and allegations of marital infidelity - Page 3 - Historum

steve53 · March 14th, 2012, 12:04 AM

This, I think, illustrates a point.

People tend to put their heroes on pedestals. They NEED heroes. And, more importantly, people LOVE to be thought of as heroes.

Now, like it or not, to become the whole package, you've got to be pretty clean. Especially if you are a champion of Human Rights. In defense of MLK, and JFK, they probably both never said they were perfect. And back in those times, no one even asked if they were beating up prostitutes, or having sex all over the White House. But...what if MLK had been a pedophile, for instance? Or JFK murdered someone in cold blood? Would those uncovered facts deserve to sully their modern image?
Their amoral activities can go directly to motivation, which is a legitimate issue. Did JFK become president so he could get better chicks, and with Secret Service protection? Did MLK become what he was to have better access to prostitutes or whatever the hell else he did?

Now to Clinton. Is he an icon? No. He can't be. He lied before a federal judge, and tried to besmirch the name of a not-so-innocent girl, but still he was ready to bury her to preserve his presidency. With MLK and JFK, no one ever asked.

Compare that to Albert Einstein, who was philanderer (I think). Point is that no one has bothered to expose him, because HE was not the icon. His THEORIES were his accomplishment, and those survived despite every tomato thrown at it. All great artists, musicians, engineers- they get a pass. No one cares.

When you are in the public domain, you are fair game. But if you create something timeless, beautiful, and useful, no one is going to care about your private life. If you put yourself out as an icon who represents a political or social agenda, for people to have faith in, your house better be in order.

**redcoat** · March 14th, 2012, 04:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by men

Links on this? I am very curious. I was only recently listening to an On The Media piece on how much of the "I Had a Dream" speech borrowed and referenced common sermons, and that this was acceptable practice in black churches. Related?

No biggie, Churchill was noted for 'borrowing parts' of his speeches as well. What matters is that it motivates and inspires the people hearing it.

Whether or not it's completely original is, in all honesty, an irrelevance.

bmben · March 14th, 2012, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redcoat

No biggie, Churchill was noted for 'borrowing parts' of his speeches as well. What matters is that it motivates and inspires the people hearing it.

Whether or not it's completely original is, in all honesty, an irrelevance.

Yes, I agree with this. How many times has Winthrope's "City Upon a Hill" speech been used? I was merely wondering if the alleged plagiarism was in this vein. Unfortunately, it was not. However, I agree with the consensus that certain instances of poor judgment do not discredit a man (or a woman.)

My favorite quote from my least favorite 21st century President is "When I was young and stupid, I was young and stupid." Genius.

**Mike McClure** · March 14th, 2012, 12:48 PM

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Originally Posted by SomeGuy

Nobody is saying that. If anything, stuff like this shows they were real people with their own flaws and not just a demigod; their accomplishments can be seen as more heroic rather than an obligation they were forced into by destiny.

I tend to agree with you. The thing is that if our heroes have the same flaws as we do, what is our excuse. Why can't we do great things too.

HammockHank · March 14th, 2012, 03:42 PM

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Originally Posted by Mike McClure

I tend to agree with you. The thing is that if our heroes have the same flaws as we do, what is our excuse. Why can't we do great things too.

Ordinary people do great things all the time, Mike, they just don't get the publicity. If you're a father when you take the kids to the ball game or to music lessons; when you're there for a school play; help them with their homework; basically, being there for what an adult might think is just a little thing it's really important to the kids.

There are a million other things people do that they don't have to and when they do it there's no one watching. Being a good citizen, a hard worker, an honest person. That's greatness an inch at a time. It's what makes society liveable and pleasant.

**okamido** · March 14th, 2012, 07:08 PM

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Originally Posted by redcoat

Whether or not it's completely original is, in all honesty, an irrelevance.

How about his PHD dissertation though? It was obviously forgiven due to the work he did later in his life...but should it have been?

steve53 · March 14th, 2012, 08:35 PM

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Originally Posted by okamido

How about his PHD dissertation though? It was obviously forgiven due to the work he did later in his life...but should it have been?

All programs have advisers who guide the candidates and should screen for that sort of thing.

**Mike McClure** · March 14th, 2012, 08:39 PM

You have to take a person as he is. The plagiarism, the unfaithfulness is part of who Martin Luther King was. It doesn't take away from what he accomplished but it shouldn't be ignored. It is part of who he was.

steve53 · March 14th, 2012, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike McClure

You have to take a person as he is. The plagiarism, the unfaithfulness is part of who Martin Luther King was. It doesn't take away from what he accomplished but it shouldn't be ignored. It is part of who he was.

BTW, I read online that the FBI records on MLK have been sealed until 2027. Someone in power asked former FBI director Patrick Gray about them. All he said was that there were 15 filing cabinets filled with information on MLK over the years. Only one contained his alleged communist activities. Fourteen filing cabinets contained tapes and transcripts and reports on his sexual indiscretions.

**Yorgos** · March 15th, 2012, 12:33 AM

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Originally Posted by NEW ARK?

MLK is a hero of mine. With that being said, I absolutely disagree with letting "stuff like this rest." Should we "let it rest" that JFK cheated on his wife regularly? Should we forget about the fact that Abraham Lincoln made speeches that were overtly racist? Maybe we should also forget that Malcolm X was a drug addict before he joined the NATION OF ISLAM. MLK was a plagiarist and he cheated on his wife. If we chose to ignore these facts his history gets whitewashed in favor of a type of "feel good" history where all of our historical figures become saint-like and boring. By including the warts and blemishes of his life we get a more complete and better picture of this great man. The average man would be able to identify with him better because MLK was a human being; he was not a God-fearing, pious man for every single moment of his life. And we should celebrate this great man for exactly what he was: An amazing and courageous man who, in the face of unthinkable adversity, lifted millions of African-Americans out of second-class citizen status and forced the country to deal with a sickness that was tearing our society apart. It just so happened that part of his "I Have A Dream Speech" was plagiarized. It appears that he liked to smoke cigarettes, drink alcohol, and have sex with prostitutes. These things take nothing away from his greatness. I would argue that they make the man more interesting. Imagine the discussions these facts would generate in a high school classroom. They would be heated and fascinating.

I can only applaud.

Martin Luther King Junior is a hero for humanity. When Rosa Parks imposed her dignity, I see in her action my own dignity restored, even though I was born thousand miles away, years after that single, apparently simple action of the Lady. And, as you thoughtfully point, personal life of Martin Luther King Junior is relevant only to make his history more fascinating for us. His legacy is what he did for human rights.