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Old November 23rd, 2012, 05:54 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Panthera tigris altaica View Post
Truthfully, we can't say that the issue didn't touch civil war America at some level of society. It did, but not in the way most think, i believe. I think the Confederate government would have had a very hard time raising an army if they truthfully told the Southern volunteers they were fighting for the planting class rights to own slaves, rather than a states right to decide what was best for itself.
I agree there, the average southern soldier was definitely fighting for his state, his family, and his pride. It did not sit well that terms were dictated to a South that had not been defeated in battle. I am not saying that southerners would have ever been rational at the time if the argument were correct, but I do argue that southerners fought for what they believed in, even if the start of the war was caused by slavery.
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Old November 23rd, 2012, 05:57 PM   #42

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I agree there, the average southern soldier was definitely fighting for his state, his family, and his pride. It did not sit well that terms were dictated to a South that had not been defeated in battle. I am not saying that southerners would have ever been rational at the time if the argument were correct, but I do argue that southerners fought for what they believed in, even if the start of the war was caused by slavery.
I agree. The political issue that caused the war was not necessarily the cause that the soldiers were fighting for.
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Old November 23rd, 2012, 06:02 PM   #43

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Yes, a psycophathic Yank, and Scarlett blows his brains out! If your wife isn't interested, just say "frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn!"
Of course, you know i kid. I'm not really interested in seeing a movie that paints either side as psychopathic black or virtuous white. I don't know why, but it just feels insulting to the memory of the slaves, the society of the time and Billy yank or a Johnny reb.
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Old November 23rd, 2012, 06:05 PM   #44

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Of course, you know i kid. I'm not really interested in seeing a movie that paints either side as psychopathic black or virtuous white. I don't know why, but it just feels insulting to the memory of the slaves, the society of the time and Billy yank or a Johnny reb.
Yes, I do know that, Panther, and I agree completely.
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Old November 23rd, 2012, 06:10 PM   #45

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Yes, I do know that, Panther, and I agree completely.
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Old November 23rd, 2012, 08:25 PM   #46

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It did not sit well that terms were dictated to a South that had not been defeated in battle.
Shiloh, Vicksburg, Chattanooga and Lookout Mountain, Antietam, Gettysburg, Petersburg, Five Forks, Atlanta, Mobile, Franklin and Nashiville were all Union victories.

By 1865 the Confederate army had not only been beaten in battle, it had been destroyed as a fighting force.

Or to put it another way:

"My own corps was stretched until themen stood like a row of vedettes, fifteen feet apart... It was not a line; it was the mere skeleton of a line." - John B. Gordon, General CSA 1865 before Grant finally assualted the Petersburg lines.

"On and on, hour after hour, from hilltop to hilltop, the lines were alternately forming, fighting, and retreating, making one almost continuous battle. A boy soldier came running by at the top of his speed. When asked why he was running, he shouted back, I'm running 'cause I can't fly!" - John B. Gordon, General CSA describing the Confederate retreat to Appomatox Court House.
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Old November 23rd, 2012, 08:42 PM   #47
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Shiloh, Vicksburg, Chattanooga and Lookout Mountain, Antietam, Gettysburg, Petersburg, Five Forks, Atlanta, Mobile, Franklin and Nashiville were all Union victories.

By 1865 the Confederate army had not only been beaten in battle, it had been destroyed as a fighting force.

Or to put it another way:

"My own corps was stretched until themen stood like a row of vedettes, fifteen feet apart... It was not a line; it was the mere skeleton of a line." - John B. Gordon, General CSA 1865 before Grant finally assualted the Petersburg lines.

"On and on, hour after hour, from hilltop to hilltop, the lines were alternately forming, fighting, and retreating, making one almost continuous battle. A boy soldier came running by at the top of his speed. When asked why he was running, he shouted back, I'm running 'cause I can't fly!" - John B. Gordon, General CSA describing the Confederate retreat to Appomatox Court House.
Sorry for the misunderstanding. I was arguing the rational for why the South fought. You and I are talking about completely different episodes, that was not what I was talking about.
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Old November 23rd, 2012, 08:59 PM   #48

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I agree there, the average southern soldier was definitely fighting for his state, his family, and his pride. It did not sit well that terms were dictated to a South that had not been defeated in battle..
I see your point and clearly understand it.
The CSA militarily was still a dangerous force in the field, but
when the Union war effort started to cause the Southern civilian
population to suffer, then naturally the CSA soldier thought of his
loved ones at home and that burning, stubborn will to fight was then tempered by tender thoughts of them.
Click the image to open in full size.
Gen. Lee's farewell said it best, "After four years of arduous service marked by unsurpassed courage and fortitude....You will take with you the satisfaction that proceeds from the consciousness of duty faithfully performed, and I earnestly pray that a merciful God will extend to you his blessing and protection."
General Order No. 9.
10 April 1865.
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