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Old September 15th, 2015, 04:14 AM   #41

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Scaeva, by the standards of the time and place he came of age was Ford despicable? Antisemitism was pretty rampant in at the turn of the century, as was the belief that most Southern European descended naturalized Americans should be barred from the best schools and neighborhoods.
Even if it's popular, doesn't mean it's acceptable.
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Old September 15th, 2015, 04:45 AM   #42

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Even if it's popular, doesn't mean it's acceptable.
In retrospect, of course.
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Old September 15th, 2015, 05:35 AM   #43
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MacArthur, Andrew Jackson, Burr
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Old September 15th, 2015, 05:55 AM   #44

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This didn't clarify your position, I'm afraid! I was hoping for something more like:

I, ETigerstar "hate" Henry Ford because ________ ?

Do you "hate" the fact that half of America was driving even by the mid '30s?

Maybe I just can't decode youthful writing. Probably my shortcoming, but I see a tension between "hating" Reagan for de-industrializing the USA and the "hate" of Ford.

Or, if you are a Packer fan and "hate" the Ford family-owned Detroit Lions, I will accept that rationale? Peace, K
OH! You're asking why I DISLIKE him?

His anti-semitic views and the fact that he promoted such views and included anti-semitic pamphlets in all ford vehicles up to the end of World War II.
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Old September 15th, 2015, 06:42 AM   #45
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Agreed about Edison, Ford, and Reagan.

Also, though, would Andrew Jackson work for this? :
Yes, Edison was terrific. Just remember, though, that each time you plug in an appliance or a charger, it was Nikola Tesla and not Edison who made that possible. Edison's DC current was a loser. Tesla was quirky and odd, bnt I believe he was a full blown genius, just not a businessman.

Last edited by royal744; September 15th, 2015 at 07:28 AM.
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Old September 15th, 2015, 06:57 AM   #46
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FDR: I don't like the socialist policies he introduced, but he got the U.S. through the war.
Wilson: Another progressive, but he did have a great deal of empathy for a re-created Poland.
Robert E. Lee: On the wrong side of the Civil War, but a great military leader.
Andrew Carnegie: An enigma of sorts. He came from humble beginnings and, in theory, opposed elitism, although he lived and acted like a king through much of his business career. In the end, he gave most of his money toward charitable projects that benefited the workers who helped make his millions.

Kindly look up the definition of the word "socialist" before you apply it to someone. Socialism espouses the ownership of the means of production by the government, you know, the government owning industries, railroads, mines, etc. Roosevelt never advocated any of that, ever. What you are taslking about are social benefits like social security, medicare,. medicaid and so on. Roosevelt passed social security. During the Great Depression he set up many agencies and administrations to assist with the floundering economy, but he never advocated the government owning the means of production. A lot of people who don't know their history - or the definition of words they use - use terms that are just plain wrong. Calling FDR a socialist is an example of this.

Last edited by royal744; September 15th, 2015 at 07:27 AM.
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Old September 15th, 2015, 07:04 AM   #47
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Thomas Paine, he is remembered for his pamphlet Common Sense which for me, as a Tory, may be enough to dislike the man. But he was worse than the average revolutionary by far. He was a traitor at heart and nothing more, he first betrayed his King for the American Revolutionaries, he then betrayed Britain for France, and when his loyalties to the French Revolution backfired and he was imprisoned by Robespierre, he turned his bile and hatred on America, accusing Washington of engaging in some bizarre conspiracy against him. And while he is known for Common Sense, perhaps he should be known for his pamphlet Agrarian Justice, a document that can only be described as communist propaganda, despite having been written two decades before Marx was born. He betrayed all they he ever served and for his treachery was abandoned by all his friends before his death. When death finally came, he was denied burial on consecrated ground by the Quakers and only six people attended his funeral.

On November 12th, 1802, the New York Evening Post wrote of him:

'The eulogists of Paine in attempting to establish his claims on the bounty of Congress, forget to remember that the same person who was paid like Callendar for his writing (only more liberally) had been disgraced by Congress in '77, and dismissed from the office of secretary to the committe for foreign affairs, for drunkenness and falsehood. They draw a veil over his transactions while in Paris, and particularly over his hostile measures against this country in the war which he strove to imbitter between the two nations. This alone, independent of the renumerations of Congress, did away, they well know, all the claims upon the gratitude of Americans for his Common Sense, and his Crisis -- But his Age of Reason and his Infamous letter to Washington, setting aside his machinations against this country, will ultimately in the mind of every man, except possibly Mr. Jefferson, put him upon a par with the once gallant but traitorous Arnold.'

Upon his death, the New York Evening Post summed up his life in perhaps the most gracious manner possible:

'He had lived long, done some good, and much harm.'
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Old September 15th, 2015, 07:22 AM   #48

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Yes, Edison was terrific. Just remember, though, that each time you plug in an appliance or a charger, it was Nikola Tesla and not Edison who made thast possible. Edison's DC current was a loser. Tesla was quirky and odd, bnut I believe he was a full blown genius, just not a businessman.
Ahh, the great Westinghouse-GE divide!

By this era, no one man could change the technology single-handedly. We Yanks have to be realists that the combination of Michael Faraday and James Clerk Maxwell laid the foundations for all electrical engineering. Even an Edison and Tesla were skiing in their wake, in fact.
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Old September 15th, 2015, 07:24 AM   #49

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OH! You're asking why I DISLIKE him?

His anti-semitic views and the fact that he promoted such views and included anti-semitic pamphlets in all ford vehicles up to the end of World War II.
Thanks, ETigerstar. I'm just trying to understand a thought process. Since my age group is lot closer to post-war industrial order, I actually observed it as a living entity, there are bound to be differences in perspective.
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Old September 15th, 2015, 08:43 AM   #50
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Bill Gates and Warren Buffet are overrated. I don't hate them at all (I respect them).

I've read and listened to lots of interviews and such from them. Nothing they said was so intelligent that it amazed me. Are they smart? Yes. But probably not smarter than half of their class at university.

They worked really hard, but primarily, they came around at the right time and got lucky.
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