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March 22nd, 2010, 06:34 PM
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#21 | | l'esprit de l'escalier
Joined: Jan 2010 From: ♪♬ ♫♪♩ Posts: 12,298 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Belloc Well both Catholics and Eastern Orthodox disagree with you, since they canonized him a saint. | Pfff... They gave Obame the Noble price for Peace...
At times the Saint-making process was like a reward for service to the pope, and the territorial spread of the Rome's influence. (Louis IX)
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:35 PM
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#22 | | Historian
Joined: Mar 2010 From: USA Posts: 4,346 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeno Pfff... They gave Obame the Noble price for Peace... | The Nobel peace prize isn't associated with either church.
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:36 PM
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#23 | | l'esprit de l'escalier
Joined: Jan 2010 From: ♪♬ ♫♪♩ Posts: 12,298 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Belloc The Nobel peace prize isn't associated with either church. | It's something humans give to other humans because they like what he does/did is supposed to do. That fits their ideology.
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:37 PM
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#24 | | Unchained ¤ Blog of the Year ¤
Joined: Oct 2009 From: Baltimorean-in-exile Posts: 17,048 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Belloc Well both Catholics and Eastern Orthodox disagree with you, since they canonized him a saint. | His Edict of Mediolanum/Milan gave freedom of worship to the whole Empire - it did not - contrary to popular accounts - turn Rome into a Christian Empire (that didn't happen until under Theodosius in the late 4th Century). His policy of toleration - immediately following a period of harsh persecution under Diocletian and Maximian - made him a hero in the sight of the Empire's Christians, and summarily he has had a good name in European history. But this doesn't change the fact that, as I said above, he was a very typical product of his day.
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:37 PM
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#25 | | Unchained ¤ Blog of the Year ¤
Joined: Oct 2009 From: Baltimorean-in-exile Posts: 17,048 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeno It's something humans give to other humans because they like what he does. | You hit the nail on the head, here.
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:39 PM
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#26 | | Historian
Joined: Mar 2010 From: USA Posts: 4,346 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeno It's something humans give to other humans because they like what he does/did is supposed to do. That fits their ideology. | Still doesn't prove that Catholics gave Obama the prize. You realise that there's a certain rigorous procedure in canonizing saints, which often takes decades if not centuries in some cases?
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:43 PM
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#27 | | Historian
Joined: Mar 2010 From: USA Posts: 4,346 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Salah ad-Din His Edict of Mediolanum/Milan gave freedom of worship to the whole Empire - it did not - contrary to popular accounts - turn Rome into a Christian Empire (that didn't happen until under Theodosius in the late 4th Century). His policy of toleration - immediately following a period of harsh persecution under Diocletian and Maximian - made him a hero in the sight of the Empire's Christians, and summarily he has had a good name in European history. | Yes I'm aware of all this. Quote: |
But this doesn't change the fact that, as I said above, he was a very typical product of his day.
| Saints come in all forms and sizes.
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:43 PM
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#28 | | l'esprit de l'escalier
Joined: Jan 2010 From: ♪♬ ♫♪♩ Posts: 12,298 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Belloc Still doesn't prove that Catholics gave Obama the prize. You realise that there's a certain rigorous procedure in canonizing saints, which often takes decades if not centuries in some cases? | We're still waiting here in Belgium for Father Damian (°January 3, 1840 – +April 15, 1889) to get holy... He worked with people suffering from lepracy on Molokaï, Hawaii. He's now in the phase before it. "Zalig" , in Dutch. Beatified. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Father_Damien$
edit: ah, he's holy now, officially? Canonized on October 11, 2009. Not so long ago. Great!
Do you know how the procedure goes?
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Last edited by Zeno; March 22nd, 2010 at 07:27 PM.
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:45 PM
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#29 | | Unchained ¤ Blog of the Year ¤
Joined: Oct 2009 From: Baltimorean-in-exile Posts: 17,048 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Belloc Saints come in all forms and sizes. | But does any man truly worthy of the title of "saint" turn on and butcher his allies, or execute his own wife of several decades and his son?
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March 22nd, 2010, 06:46 PM
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#30 | | Historian
Joined: Mar 2010 From: USA Posts: 4,346 | Re: Constantine and Christianity Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeno Do you know how the procedure goes? | Here's a rough summary of it: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02364b.htm | | |
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