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Old December 14th, 2013, 11:45 PM   #1
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Roman world vs. Hellenistic world vs. "the Barbaric" world(Romans cripiled knowlege?)


I just watched Terry Jones-"Barbarians" series coverying the Roman conquests and the guy really really hates Romans to almost biased level, proclaiming the Church is the modern institution of Roman greed and decandance.

You can watch the parts on Youtube.

He points out how the Romans were very uninovative and not scientific compared to Hellenistic world, and Roman scientists and matheticians didn't exist. Didn't Greeks get citizenship with a Roman identity? Inventions made by Greeks were so extrodanarry.

And the Romans were somehow more greedy and decandant than their Hellenistic and Barbarian counterparts.

How true is this? Although the Romans copied a lot from the Hellenistic world, they used the technology on mass to mass quanity. How scientific were the Romans? Were the Hellenistic world more focused when it came to conquest?
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Old December 15th, 2013, 12:13 AM   #2

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Googled "ancient Roman scientists"...got one; Lucilius Junior. Astronomers, four, Philoshophers, none. Mr Jones' point is proven, methinks.
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Old December 15th, 2013, 04:00 AM   #3
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I have to disagree.
Roman engineering was top-notch and unmatched in its day.
Rome had philosophers, astronomers, scientists and mathematics.
Yes, Rome was influenced by the greeks. But that doesn't mean that what they accomplished wasn't of their making. As far as I know there isn't any merit to Mr. Terry Jones's words.
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Old December 15th, 2013, 04:09 AM   #4

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Originally Posted by WinterIsComing View Post
I have to disagree.
Roman engineering was top-notch and unmatched in its day.
Rome had philosophers, astronomers, scientists and mathematics.
Yes, Rome was influenced by the greeks. But that doesn't mean that what they accomplished wasn't of their making. As far as I know there isn't any merit to Mr. Terry Jones's words.
Okay, name 3 Roman scientists.
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Old December 15th, 2013, 04:15 AM   #5
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Okay, name 3 Roman scientists.
Pliny the elder, Lucilius Junior, Galen, and Ptolemy. That's 4 for you.
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Old December 15th, 2013, 04:19 AM   #6

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It's based on the book:

Terry Jones' Barbarians: Amazon.co.uk: Terry Jones, Alan Ereira: Books
Terry Jones' Barbarians: Amazon.co.uk: Terry Jones, Alan Ereira: Books


Who were the Barbarians?

Greek "barbarians" (Archimedes speared by a Roman soldier)
Irish Celtic "barbarians"
British Celtic "barbarians" (centralised Druidic priesthood)
Scotish Celtic "barbarians"
Gallic Celtic "barbarians"
Germanic Celtic "barbarians"
Dacian Celtic "barbarians"
Jewish and Hebrew "barbarians"
Parthian/Persian "barbarians"
Goths, Visigoths and Astrogoth "barbarians"
The Vandals, etc "barbarians"
The mysterious Huns
All who were non-Roman, were "barbarians".


The book presented a thesis:
"The thesis is that we've all been told a false history of Rome that has twisted our entire understanding of our own history - glorifying (and glossing over) a long era of ruthless imperial power ..."
I have not seen the documentary but have read the book.
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Old December 15th, 2013, 04:26 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kookaburra Jack View Post
It's based on the book:

Terry Jones' Barbarians: Amazon.co.uk: Terry Jones, Alan Ereira: [email]Books

Who were the Barbarians?

Greek "barbarians" (Archimedes speared by a Roman soldier)
Irish Celtic "barbarians"
British Celtic "barbarians" (centralised Druidic priesthood)
Scotish Celtic "barbarians"
Gallic Celtic "barbarians"
Germanic Celtic "barbarians"
Dacian Celtic "barbarians"
Jewish and Hebrew "barbarians"
Parthian/Persian "barbarians"
Goths, Visigoths and Astrogoth "barbarians"
The Vandals, etc "barbarians"
The mysterious Huns
All who were non-Roman, were "barbarians".


The book presented a thesis:
"The thesis is that we've all been told a false history of Rome that has twisted our entire understanding of our own history - glorifying (and glossing over) a long era of ruthless imperial power ..."
I have not seen the documentary but have read the book.
All who didn't have democracy, spoke greek and/or roman was barbarian. That's why the greeks looked upon Macedon/Phillip II as barbaric in the begining (though this would change).
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Old December 15th, 2013, 05:09 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by WinterIsComing View Post
All who didn't have democracy, spoke greek and/or roman was barbarian. That's why the greeks looked upon Macedon/Phillip II as barbaric in the begining (though this would change).
Only part of Greece was democratic. Oligarchic poleis were the majority.
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Old December 15th, 2013, 05:25 AM   #9
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Only part of Greece was democratic. Oligarchic poleis were the majority.
My understanding is that a Polis was ruled mainly by the body of its citizens?
But it depends on the time period, I guess.
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Old December 15th, 2013, 05:29 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinterIsComing View Post
My understanding is that a Polis was ruled mainly by the body of its citizens?
But it depends on the time period, I guess.
For most of Ancient Greek history, most poleis had an oligarchic system:which gives the elites the leadership(but citizens were often allowed to take part). A good instance for an oligarchic state is the Roman Republic.
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