The origin of the word "Aryan" - Historum

**Satuf** · December 21st, 2009, 05:11 PM

There are many theories over the origin of the word "Aryan" and one of those theories that I really don't know how accurate it is:

The Akkadians called the Indo-European person an "Ary" which means "Naked" (Aryans were barbarians at that time) and the word "Ary" in Arabic today still means "Naked", and I don't need to demonstrate how close Akkadian is to Arabic..

Any other theories? facts?

Recusant · December 21st, 2009, 05:27 PM

I'm inclined to accept the more conventional etymology: That the word "Aryan" derives from Sanskrit, "arya." I'm curious, why do you doubt this etymology?

Wikipedia has articles on the subject, of course, but for a slightly more scholarly look at the etymology, you can read this article, from Haryana Online, a website for the Indian state of Haryana.

Quote:

*Aryo- (indo-iranian *arya-) is an adjective to the PIE root *ar-, originally meaning 'to assemble', possibly with positive overtones of 'accomplished, skillful'. *arya- as the name of a people, the 'Aryans', is only attested in India and Persia, but the root is well known from other languages in the Indo-European world, e.g. the aristoi, the "most noble," of Greece, and possibly Éire, a native name of Ireland (although this is not commonly accepted). The original meaning of the root, pertaining to skillful assembly (art), union, confederacy, may be perceived in Latin ordo 'order' or in Greek harma 'chariot'.

**Satuf** · December 21st, 2009, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recusant

I'm inclined to accept the more conventional etymology: That the word "Aryan" derives from Sanskrit, "arya." I'm curious, why do you doubt this etymology?

Wikipedia has articles on the subject, of course, but for a slightly more scholarly look at the etymology, you can read this article, from Haryana Online, a website for the Indian state of Haryana.

I don't doubt that etymology..I'm seeking for more theories/facts.

Recusant · December 21st, 2009, 10:05 PM

Well, you got me curious, so I started digging. Not too surprisingly, I was soon in well over my head.

I haven't found the source for

Quote:

The Akkadians called the Indo-European person an "Ary" which means "Naked" ...

yet, but I've really only begun. Perhaps you could help me by pointing me to a good source or two? I did, however, find a complex (to me) linguistic article by one Jahanshah Derakhshani called "Some Earliest Traces of the Aryan / Evidence From the 3rd and 4th Millennium BC"(pdf file) which while fascinating, did not really illuminate the alternate etymology which you give. In fact, Derakhshani, in the very first part of section 4 of the paper gives yet another possible etymology: ari = "stranger", or possibly "high" or "highlander." Anyway, I'll have to look into the background of the learned Derakshani to see what, if any, particular agenda he may be pursuing.

Next, I found ÂRYÂ (ARYAN) / Philology of Ethnic Epithet of Iranian Peoples, by Sir Harold Bailey. He gives this possible meaning:

Quote:

...associating arya- with good birth...

Well, one thing that I think I've learned so far, is that the term is probably older than Sanskrit, but that, as you say, there are several possible etymologies. Not as clear-cut as I had thought when I read your OP, and assumed that I had a good idea of the origin of the word.

corrocamino · December 22nd, 2009, 02:40 AM

Sanskrit -- although it is the earliest attested Indo-European language -- was itself on the Indo-Iranian branch of IE languages, if I recall correctly. So, a great deal about what went before is left to inference, the realm of PIE. Interesting that Iran means "aryan", and that the Lithuanian language, of all extant IE languages, is deemed closest to Sanskrit. I would like to know if the Ayans destroyed the Indus Civilization, or whether the latter had collapsed from climate change before the advent of the charioteers.

It is also intriguing to consider the isolated remnants of non-IE languages in Europe: Etruscan, Basque.

Fascinating stuff!

**Satuf** · December 22nd, 2009, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recusant

Well, you got me curious, so I started digging. Not too surprisingly, I was soon in well over my head.

I haven't found the source for

yet, but I've really only begun. Perhaps you could help me by pointing me to a good source or two? I did, however, find a complex (to me) linguistic article by one Jahanshah Derakhshani called "Some Earliest Traces of the Aryan / Evidence From the 3rd and 4th Millennium BC"(pdf file) which while fascinating, did not really illuminate the alternate etymology which you give. In fact, Derakhshani, in the very first part of section 4 of the paper gives yet another possible etymology: ari = "stranger", or possibly "high" or "highlander." Anyway, I'll have to look into the background of the learned Derakshani to see what, if any, particular agenda he may be pursuing.

Next, I found ÂRYÂ (ARYAN) / Philology of Ethnic Epithet of Iranian Peoples, by Sir Harold Bailey. He gives this possible meaning:

Well, one thing that I think I've learned so far, is that the term is probably older than Sanskrit, but that, as you say, there are several possible etymologies. Not as clear-cut as I had thought when I read your OP, and assumed that I had a good idea of the origin of the word.

The sources I have are in Arabic (I don't really remember where I read it

) but I am very skeptical about that.

I'll go with your theories

Whyte · December 22nd, 2009, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by corrocamino

It is also intriguing to consider the isolated remnants of non-IE languages in Europe: Etruscan, Basque.

Simply taking a moment to point out the three Finno-Ugric (hence non-IE) languages in Europa as well: Finnish, Estonian and Hungarian.

corrocamino · December 22nd, 2009, 11:11 AM

Right -- knew about them, but they are not isolates, rather with clear affinities to the Ugaric-Uralic family originating to the east. Nevertheless, good to point these out. Thank you.

**Lucius** · December 22nd, 2009, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by corrocamino

I would like to know if the Ayans destroyed the Indus Civilization, or whether the latter had collapsed from climate change before the advent of the charioteers.

There is a thought that the Indus River civilization destroyed itself. As we know, the bricks at Harappa, Mohenjodaro, Lothal, are of the kiln-dried type. Yet there are no forests close by to fuel the kilns - anymore. They might have caused their own demise by de-foresting the river valleys.

corrocamino · December 23rd, 2009, 04:48 AM

Certainly pluasible, Lucius. There is wide agreement that the Maya outbred the land's capacity to support them, too. How soon will will we have 10 billion? Nature has an expedient called population crash, and a number of tested tools to implement it...

(Nature doesn't know us from a dinosaur, by the way.)