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Old November 27th, 2017, 12:26 PM   #1
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Indo-European homeland is North India


The original Indo-European (Aryan) homeland is North India, as proven by Shrikanth Talageri.

The Vedas have recorded history of tribes expanding outwards from India into Europe after the Battle of 10 kings.

The battle of 10 kings was fought by the Alans, Persians, Bactrians, Pakhtoons, Phyrgians, Dacians, Medians, Parthians, Hellenes, Germans, Slavs, etc. who were all in the Punjab/Pakistan/Afghanistan area, and this outward migration is recorded in the Rig Veda.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 03:11 PM   #2
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Elephants and peacocks are also not from Russia. The horse is also native to India.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 03:28 PM   #3

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bharadwaja Brahmin View Post
Elephants and peacocks are also not from Russia. The horse is also native to India.
Virtually all slavic languages use the word "slon", which is not similar to the sanskrit Gaja or the latin elephant.

To me this means that indo-europeans didn't know about elephants and later adopted all kinds of different words, from whoever told them about it.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 04:17 PM   #4
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I am bit confused by the geography that your talking about. The title thread is North India which would proximate to the red box numbered [1] below. Box 2 covers the region you describe, Af-Pak-Punjab which is numbered [2] in the map below.

If it is box 2 your talking about that is not the north of the sub-continent but is the north west. Box 1 covers the north of the sub-continent which does not fit in with your description.


Click the image to open in full size.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 05:03 PM   #5

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Originally Posted by Bharadwaja Brahmin View Post
Elephants and peacocks are also not from Russia. The horse is also native to India.
The peacock inhabits lands ranging from the Iranian Plateau, through India, all the way to SEA. It is not something exclusive only to India. The horse is a native of Central Asia, not India. While the earliest archaeological evidence for horse domestication comes from places in Ukraine & Kazakhstan, dating to around 3500 – 4000 BC.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 06:43 PM   #6

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bharadwaja Brahmin View Post
as proven by Shrikanth Talageri.
That banker! Did he prove it for good?

Elephant: https://www.google.co.in/search?q=wo...hrome&ie=UTF-8
Sanskrit: Ibhah (http://spokensanskrit.org/index.php?...k=didse&mode=3).
Mammoth: "A mammoth is any species of the extinct genus Mammuthus, proboscideans commonly equipped with long, curved tusks and, in northern species, a covering of long hair. They lived from the Pliocene epoch (from around 5 million years ago) into the Holocene at about 4,500 years ago in Africa, Europe, Asia, and North America. They were members of the family Elephantidae, which also contains the two genera of modern elephants and their ancestors. Mammoths stem from an ancestral species called M. africanavus, the African mammoth. These mammoths lived in northern Africa and disappeared about 3 or 4 million years ago. Descendants of these mammoths moved north and eventually covered most of Eurasia. These were M. meridionalis, the 'southern mammoths'."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mammoth

Click the image to open in full size. Rouffignac-Saint-Cernin-de-Reilhac, 530 km South of Paris.

Click the image to open in full size. Pygmy mammoth, height 5.6 ft., weight 760 Kgs.
Mammuthus exilis and Mammuthus columbi became extinct around 130,000 years ago in the Quartery Extinction event. Humans were around at that time.

Read up, find, collate, that is 'Historical research', not just making assertions. There is so much to know.

Last edited by Aupmanyav; November 27th, 2017 at 07:45 PM.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 07:30 PM   #7

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Originally Posted by Bharadwaja Brahmin View Post
The horse is also native to India.
It actually isn't. There is a reason there are no native horse populations in India, either as wild or as distinct domesticated breeds.
Even the contested horse evidence of the IVC cannot prove nativity, only presence, which can be explained through trade. It is used to counter the argument that the Horse was unfamiliar to the IVC, but it doesn't prove nativity.

The Horse has historically not only not been native to India, but doesn't particularly thrive here. This is why Indian state fielding cavalry forces have had to consistently and continuously reinforce their stocks with imports from Persia and Arabia, since India's climate tends to result in the inferiorization of horse breeds. This is, AFAIK, a continuing issue.

Its worth noting however that Equuids are native to India. This is the Indian Ass, which is infact found in native populations. It is a close cousin of the Horse.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 07:54 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by TupSum View Post
Virtually all slavic languages use the word "slon", which is not similar to the sanskrit Gaja or the latin elephant.

To me this means that indo-europeans didn't know about elephants and later adopted all kinds of different words, from whoever told them about it.
Actually, in Old Slavic, particularly in Old Church Slavic, the word for camel is "velibodŭ". This is a cognate with the Proto-Indo-European (PIE) word for elephant, which is "labhantha". Because elephants don't exist in Europe or Russia, the Slavs and Germans transferred their word for elephant to the next largest thing, camel.

One Sanskrit word for elephant is "ibha", the more ancient derivative of it is "Rbha".

"Rbha" also means "tusk" (Latin ebur means tusk/ivory), so adding "manta/vanta" to the end makes it "Rbhavantha", which means "tusker". The word "Rbha" comes from the root "Rabh". In the Rig Veda "Rabh" is the same as "Labh", since L and R are interchangeable in Vedic Sanskrit. Both "Rabh" and "Labh" mean "to grasp, seize, take", referring to an elephant's trunk grasping things.

So then you have "Labhamanta", which later became "elephant", which is a cognate with Old Church Slavic "velibodŭ".

Last edited by Bharadwaja Brahmin; November 27th, 2017 at 08:11 PM.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 07:56 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Bullit View Post
I am bit confused by the geography that your talking about. The title thread is North India which would proximate to the red box numbered [1] below. Box 2 covers the region you describe, Af-Pak-Punjab which is numbered [2] in the map below.

If it is box 2 your talking about that is not the north of the sub-continent but is the north west. Box 1 covers the north of the sub-continent which does not fit in with your description.


Click the image to open in full size.
The Indo-European homeland ranges from the Khyber pass to Western Uttar Pradesh, since the Yamuna and Ganga are mentioned in the oldest books of the Rig Veda (dated to around 3,500 BCE). So it covers your whole white circle as well as the eastern part of the red square.

Last edited by Bharadwaja Brahmin; November 27th, 2017 at 08:17 PM.
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Old November 27th, 2017, 08:05 PM   #10
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The peacock inhabits lands ranging from the Iranian Plateau, through India, all the way to SEA. It is not something exclusive only to India. The horse is a native of Central Asia, not India. While the earliest archaeological evidence for horse domestication comes from places in Ukraine & Kazakhstan, dating to around 3500 – 4000 BC.
Aryan invasion proponents are not claiming the Aryans came from Iran, but Ukraine, which has no peacocks.

Few breeds of horses are from India, such as the equus siwalensis horse. However, it may have gone extinct around 8000 BCE or so. Rigveda I.162.18 and the Shatapatha Brahmana 13.5 describe the horse being sacrificed as having 34 ribs, and not 36 like the Central Asian horse, hinting at another species of horse.

Second, even if you believe horses did not originate from the interior of India, plenty of horses existed just immediately to the north of Afghanistan (which is part of the Aryan homeland).

Also, horses were domesticated in India at very early times:

"The report claiming the earliest date for the domesticated horse in India, ca. 4500 B.C.E., comes from a find from Bagor, Rajasthan, at the base of the Aravalli Hills (Ghosh 1989a, 4)".

"The report claiming the earliest date for the domesticated horse in India, ca. 4500 B.C.E., comes from a find from Bagor, Rajasthan, at the base of the Aravalli Hills (Ghosh 1989a, 4). In Rana Ghundai, Baluchistan, excavated by E. J. Ross, equine teeth were reported from a pre-Harappan level (Guha and Chatterjee 1946, 315–316). Interestingly, equine bones have been reported from Mahagara, near Allahabad, where six sample absolute carbon 14 tests have given dates ranging from 2265 B.C.E. to 1480 B.C.E. (Sharma et al. 1980, 220–221). Even more significantly, horse bones from the Neolithic site Hallur in Karnataka (1500–1300 B.C.E.) have also been identified by the archaeozoologist K. R. Alur (1971, 123). [.......] In the Indus Valley and its environs, Sewell and Guha, as early as 1931, had reported the existence of the true horse, Equus caballus Linn from Mohenjo-Daro itself, and Bholanath (1963) reported the same from Harappa, Ropar, and Lothal. Even Mortimer Wheeler identified a horse figurine and accepted that “it is likely enough that camel, horse and ass were in fact all a familiar feature of the Indus caravan” (92). Another early evidence of the horse in the Indus Valley was reported by Mackay, in 1938, who identified a clay model of the animal at Mohenjo-Daro. Piggott (1952, 126, 130) reports a horse figurine from Periano Ghundai in the Indus Valley, dated somewhere between Early Dynastic and Akkadian times. Bones from Harappa, previously thought to have belonged to the domestic ass, have been reportedly critically re-examined and attributed to a small horse (Sharma 1992–93, 31). Additional evidence of the horse in the form of bones, teeth, or figurines has been reported in other Indus sites such as Kalibangan (Sharma 1992–93, 31); Lothal (Rao 1979), Surkotada (Sharma 1974), and Malvan (Sharma 1992–93, 32). Other later sites include the Swat Valley (Stacul 1969); Gumla (Sankalia 1974, 330); Pirak (Jarrige 1985); Kuntasi (Sharma 1995, 24); and Rangpur (Rao 1979, 219)." (BRYANT 2001:169-170). Also, horse bones (Dhawalikar), as well as a terracotta figurine of a horse, have been found at Kayatha in the Chambal Valley in Madhya Pradesh in all the chalcolithic levels, dated 2450-2000 BCE. Also, there is a very distinctive horse figure in a "chess set" found at Lothal."
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