Historum - History Forums  

Go Back   Historum - History Forums > World History Forum > Asian History
Register Forums Blogs Social Groups Mark Forums Read

Asian History Asian History Forum - China, Japan, Korea, India, Australia, New Zealand, and the Asia-Pacific Region


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old January 5th, 2018, 02:52 AM   #1
Suspended indefinitely
 
Joined: Dec 2017
From: Afghanistan
Posts: 44
how converts from upper caste got Khan as title ?


In pashtuns onpy KPK and fata pashtuns use this, khan is very rare in Afghanistan as onpy Mughals used it as title and surname.

I i ow some rajput clans used this title as well because they joined Mughal armies 8n large numbers and Emperor gave theme this title. But why even non martial Brahmin converts had khan title ?



https://books.google.co.in/books?id=...ahmins&f=false
Aryan Khan Kushzai is offline  
Remove Ads
Old January 5th, 2018, 03:49 AM   #2

Dreamhunter's Avatar
Historian
 
Joined: Jun 2012
From: Malaysia
Posts: 6,425
Blog Entries: 1

Say, Aupmanyav Khan, for instance. Now, that wud sound pretty cool, I reckon.

Well, let's hear what Aup Ji has to say on this matter.
Dreamhunter is offline  
Old January 5th, 2018, 06:36 AM   #3

Aupmanyav's Avatar
Atheist, Advaitist, Hindu
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: New Delhi, India
Posts: 3,879

Aupamanyava is a 3,000 year old name. One of my kinsmen, who also went by this name, was one of the first Vedic commentor (Niruktikara) and is mentioned by Yaska, another commentator (around 700 BC). My grandfather called me Pandit Aupmanyav.

Most Pathan I have met were not from the elite strata of the society. So, I suppose descendants of the Pathans who joined the various Indian armies. There is a Pathanwada (locality) near Delhi. There is a Pathnwadi in Mumbai, Petlad Gujarat and Hyderabad (South India) also. Khan became indicative of a person who accepted Islam. It does not mean that all Khan are Pathans.

Last edited by Aupmanyav; January 5th, 2018 at 06:39 AM.
Aupmanyav is offline  
Old January 5th, 2018, 05:22 PM   #4

Aupmanyav's Avatar
Atheist, Advaitist, Hindu
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: New Delhi, India
Posts: 3,879

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aupmanyav View Post
My grandfather called me Pandit Aupmanyav.
Poor man. I failed him and did not progress beyond a graduation. But no regrets. I took life as it came to me. I forgot to add a big big .
Aupmanyav is offline  
Old January 5th, 2018, 08:16 PM   #5

Dreamhunter's Avatar
Historian
 
Joined: Jun 2012
From: Malaysia
Posts: 6,425
Blog Entries: 1

A parent always has his well meaning intentions for his offspring. But then, at the end of the day, the more important thing is that we do not fail ourselves, and we eventually become what we really wanted to be.

After all, we can't really believe that any parent wud really want to leave behind an unhappy offspring, wud he?
Dreamhunter is offline  
Old January 6th, 2018, 06:01 AM   #6

Aupmanyav's Avatar
Atheist, Advaitist, Hindu
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: New Delhi, India
Posts: 3,879

It is possible that the Rajput converts were called Khan to assuage their pride rather than just Abdul Majid, so Abdul Majid Khan. Chhotey Khan was Dewan (Wazir), an important personage in the kingdom, probably that is why.

Last edited by Aupmanyav; January 6th, 2018 at 06:06 AM.
Aupmanyav is offline  
Old January 6th, 2018, 09:00 AM   #7
Suspended indefinitely
 
Joined: Dec 2017
From: Afghanistan
Posts: 44

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aupmanyav View Post
It is possible that the Rajput converts were called Khan to assuage their pride rather than just Abdul Majid, so Abdul Majid Khan. Chhotey Khan was Dewan (Wazir), an important personage in the kingdom, probably that is why.
Many rajput clans have adopted khan title as whole like pashtuns. Take example of Janjua Rajput clan. Amir Khan Janjua a famous boxer have same Pattern as Pashtuns.
Thats really interesting if you ask me

Also if Rajputs have adopted khan as middle name i wonder what Brahmin and baniya converts use to put after their moddle name as they dont have tribe of clans like rajputs.
Aryan Khan Kushzai is offline  
Old January 8th, 2018, 03:24 AM   #8

Azad67's Avatar
Scholar
 
Joined: Aug 2014
From: pakistan
Posts: 818

Its modern days misconception that Khan means Pashtun or why XYZ community is using Khan title if they are not Pashtuns. If you go through medieval history of Iran, a whole lot of notables there were using Khan, the Turani title. For example Karim Khan Zand who became ruler of Persia. Even Georgians had Khan titles e.g Allahverdi Khan , Emamqoli Khan, Guyuk-khan, Gurgin Khan etc

In Mughal India, all the Muslim nobles serving them were given the Khan title. Even the Syeds (who carry the title of Shah these days) were given the title of Khan by Mughal rulers. (Go through Mathir-ul-umara)

The usage of Khan in Afghanistan has dampened rather recently , a read of Siraj-i-Tawrikh gives away the fact that almost every Pashtun there was using Khan title in 19th and 18th century. Pashtuns and Balochs of Pakistan have retained it as middle name but emphasis is on tribal name like medieval times, e.g Shahid Khan Afridi (Pashtun) is called Shahid Afridi and Akbar Khan Bugti (Baloch) is called Akbar Bugti. In Medieval period, you have names like Bahlul Khan Lodi and Khushal Khan Khattak but they are commonly called Bahlul Lodi and Khushal Khattak respectively. The founders of Afghanistan also had Khan as middles names. e.g Ahmad Khan Abdali (Ahmad Shah Durrani) and Mirwais Khan Hotak.
Azad67 is offline  
Old January 10th, 2018, 01:18 AM   #9

Shaheen's Avatar
Historian
 
Joined: May 2011
From: Sweden
Posts: 2,467

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aryan Khan Kushzai View Post
Many rajput clans have adopted khan title as whole like pashtuns. Take example of Janjua Rajput clan. Amir Khan Janjua a famous boxer have same Pattern as Pashtuns.
Thats really interesting if you ask me

Also if Rajputs have adopted khan as middle name i wonder what Brahmin and baniya converts use to put after their moddle name as they dont have tribe of clans like rajputs.
In the Salt Hills of northern Punjab, any group that asserted political dominance adopted this title. For example the Gakkhars who dominated the region prior to the Janjuas also referred to their leaders as Khan e.g. Sarang Khan, Adam Khan.
Shaheen is offline  
Old January 10th, 2018, 04:12 AM   #10

tornada's Avatar
Wind Lord
 
Joined: Mar 2013
From: India
Posts: 15,251
Blog Entries: 2

Isn't Khan originally a Mongol title? basically meaning King or Warlord? The Mongols were making incursions and forays in India under the Sultanate, and established a presence in much of North West India's edges. Couldn't the title and subsequent adoption as name have come directly from this source?
I'm not saying it can't also have been derived from the Mughals, but given the hegemonic domination of the Mongols on Central Asia in an ideological sense long after direct political power faded, I would think there would multiple lines of transmission of terminology from their culture. Like the term Noker, eventually culminating in the word for employee/servitor/servant in India
tornada is offline  
Reply

  Historum > World History Forum > Asian History

Tags
caste, converts, khan, title, upper



Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Why did Christianity fail horribly in getting converts in North India? Ajanbahu Asian History 194 June 24th, 2017 09:31 PM
Pashtuns got 'Khan' title from Turk Sultans of Delhi , not Mongols Azad67 Asian History 0 May 19th, 2015 09:00 PM

Copyright © 2006-2013 Historum. All rights reserved.