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Old January 13th, 2018, 01:34 PM   #11
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According to Wiki it was in the late 7th century during the reign of Munmu (626-681). Shilla conferred three titles on the rulers of T'amna: Songju (성주/星主), Wangja (왕자/王子), and Tonae (도내/都內).
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Old January 20th, 2018, 11:33 AM   #12
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Quote:
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According to Wiki it was in the late 7th century during the reign of Munmu (626-681). Shilla conferred three titles on the rulers of T'amna:
These are life dates. Reign dates are 661 to 681.
So conferral of titles on Tamna by Silla predates 681.
Tamna embassies to Japan are attested even after 690.
In that period, from 668 on, Silla and Japan were friendly, with close diplomatic intercourse.
Does this mean that Silla recognized Tamna as independent?
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Old January 20th, 2018, 01:04 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
These are life dates. Reign dates are 661 to 681.
So conferral of titles on Tamna by Silla predates 681.
Tamna embassies to Japan are attested even after 690.
In that period, from 668 on, Silla and Japan were friendly, with close diplomatic intercourse.
Does this mean that Silla recognized Tamna as independent?
Ah, thanks for the correction.

How late are the embassies attested?

Because of the bestowing of titles I would think Shilla saw T'amna as independent but something along the lines of a tributary (for lack of a better term). Probably Japan did as well, and they might have competed for influence over it, but that's getting into speculation.
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Old January 23rd, 2018, 10:56 AM   #14
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One interesting thing is that the Cheju language (yes, it's a language and not a dialect of Korean because the two are mutually unintelligible) appears to have split off from peninsular Korean during the Early Middle Korean period (though undergoing some of the same later changes). This could possibly be dated to the 12th century when Koryo annexed Cheju.
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Old January 23rd, 2018, 11:14 AM   #15
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One interesting thing is that the Cheju language (yes, it's a language and not a dialect of Korean because the two are mutually unintelligible)
You know what they say: "Language is a dialect with an army".
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Old January 23rd, 2018, 11:19 AM   #16
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You know what they say: "Language is a dialect with an army".
Yup.
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Old March 24th, 2018, 11:12 AM   #17
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So did T'amna continue sending missions to Japan until Koryo annexed it in 1105?

If not, how long did they keep sending these missions?
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Old March 24th, 2018, 12:03 PM   #18
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Okay I found some information in this book:
https://books.google.com/books?id=xa...page&q&f=false

Tamna first sent tribute to Yamato in 661 and Shilla in 662, but as the three kingdoms and other states would often do, it styled itself differently to different states depending on its own purposes. It was basically pretending to be a vassal of Shilla when dealing with Shilla and a vassal of Yamato when dealing with Yamato.

Tamna continued to pay tribute to Shilla and later Koryo until the latter annexed it in 1105.

The last tribute mission to Yamato in the Nihon shoki is from 688 and the last (possibly) Japanese envoy in 693. I'm not able to find any references to tribute missions after this.

A few places (I don't know how accurate they are) say Tamna's tribute missions continued until 679 when they were "subjected to Silla".

Last edited by Haakbus; March 24th, 2018 at 01:00 PM.
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Old March 30th, 2018, 07:07 AM   #19
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Did Tamna continuously pay tribute to Silla and then Koryo throughout the period 889-936, or ever to Later Pekche?
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Old March 30th, 2018, 08:03 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Did Tamna continuously pay tribute to Silla and then Koryo throughout the period 889-936, or ever to Later Pekche?
Good question. It might be recorded in the Samguk Sagi, but I don't know. I seriously need to order some more books.

Last edited by Haakbus; March 30th, 2018 at 08:05 AM.
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