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Old December 9th, 2012, 07:26 AM   #421

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to all those turks who still believe in pan-turkism:
come and stay in a duty-free queue before a group of central asian turks. there is a high chance that line will be blocked for almost ½ an hour and you will rush to your gate without buying anything—if not miss your flight (a common sight in istanbul ataturk airport)
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Old December 9th, 2012, 08:57 AM   #422

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It's funny how they follow what I think is a Russian custom of clapping when the plane lands. I remember them doing this on a flight from Istanbul to NY and then standing up to get their bags from the overhand compartment while the stewardess was shouting at them to sit down until the plane stopped.
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Old December 9th, 2012, 02:31 PM   #423

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Quote:
Originally Posted by antocya View Post
It's funny how they follow what I think is a Russian custom of clapping when the plane lands. I remember them doing this on a flight from Istanbul to NY and then standing up to get their bags from the overhand compartment while the stewardess was shouting at them to sit down until the plane stopped.
ehehehe this is also done by italians and turks. nothing to do with russkies.
i can understand the turks as THY has one of the worst airline accident rates in europe (http://planecrashinfo.com/rates.htm) right alongside aeroflot

Last edited by infestør; December 9th, 2012 at 02:39 PM.
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Old December 9th, 2012, 02:38 PM   #424

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Strange, I hadn't noticed this the other times I've been on flights in Turkey but I honestly have been on that many domestic flights in Turkey, may 3 total. Generally when I make the Istanbul NY connection I arrive in the middle of the night since the flight to NY is usually at noon.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 06:57 AM   #425

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Originally Posted by GalataTurk View Post
Oguz Turks are caucosid.Ancient Kyrghız were also caucosid but todays CA Turks have mongoloid features thanks to Mongols and Chinese invasions.Turk is a race and is caucasian.
Fine, so how would you explain this Arab account from the 9th century which clearly describes Turks as having mongoloid features? Mind you, it was long before the Mongol expansion and Arabs didn't have any contacts with Mongols in those times anyway.

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Volume 4, Book 52, Number 179 : Narrated by Abu Huraira
Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the turks; people with small eyes, red faces, and flat noses. Their faces will look like shields coated with leather. The Hour will not be established till you fight with people whose shoes are made of hair."
Sahih Bukhari : Read, Study, Search Online
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Old December 10th, 2012, 06:23 PM   #426

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You still have not explained why the yugur (descendants of the uyghur khaganate) are mongoloid and the modern uyghur (descendants of the karluk kara khanids) are half mongoloid and half caucasoid. The salars are also over 90% mongoloid.

I already posted pictures of mongoloid ancient uyghurs from the ancient uyghur kingdom from whom modern yugurs are descended from.
Yugurs are "Yellow Uygurs" and they are genetically same peoples with the Uyghurs from Sincan.They followed different ways after they fled from Mongolia and they settled different places.This doesnt make them unrelated peoples.
Karluk are also related to Uygurs.Mahmud al-Kashgari in his Divânu Lügati't-Türk said that "Karluk is the name of a nomadic tribes of Turks.They are different than Oghuz but they are Turkmens just like Oghuz Turks.
Karluks joined to Gokturks in 682 and later to Uyghurs in 745.They changed the name to Karakhanid after adopting Islam religion.Karluks are the first Turkics that adopted Islam.

From my point of wiev all Turkics behind Caspian Sea are more or less mongolid except Turkmenistan.They are mostly caucasians.I think Sincan Uygurs can hardly pass as caucasians.

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And did you know Ataturk refused to recognize the First East Turkestan Republic in Kashgar in 1933 when they asked for Turkey's recognition? The young turks who were advising the east turkestan republic like Mahmud Nadim Bay were anti kemalist. Ataturk knew that there were anti kemalist young turks and ottoman remnants adivising the east turkestan republic, he complained to japan when he heard japan was aiding young turks and neo ottomans like the Ottoman Prince Abdulkerim in turkestan.

Warlords and Muslims in Chinese Central Asia: A Political History of ... - Andrew D. W. Forbes - Google Books
I didnt know that.Need to search more about it.Btw im not Kemalist but im Turanist.One doesnt need to be Kemalist to love Ataturk.

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Turks in anatolia are Seljuks and ottomans, not gokturks or huns.
Basicly,
Ottomans--> Seljuks-->Oghuz Yabghu Khaganate-->Khazars

Oghuz Yabghu Khaganate was a part of Khazar Empire.After Kievan Rus defated Khazars,Oghuz Yabghu state became independent.Seljuk Bey was one of the clan leaders and he was from Kınık branch of Oghuz Turks.He converted to Islam,rejected his Shamanist brothers and he drove his clans to south areas,ME and Anatolia.

Khazar is the name of a Turkic confederation which includes Uyghurs,Proto-Bulgars,Sabirs and Pecheneks according to Jewish,Greek and Arab sources.They were part of Huns.The Khazars were a Turkic tribe that roamed the steppes from Northern China to the Black Sea. Between the 7th and 10th centuries they conquered huge swaths of what is now southern Russia and Ukraine, the Caucasus Mountains and Central Asia as far as the Aral Sea.


As you can see Turkic peoples are all related to each other somehow.The starting point is Altai and Siberia.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 06:35 PM   #427

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Originally Posted by Ayazid View Post
Fine, so how would you explain this Arab account from the 9th century which clearly describes Turks as having mongoloid features? Mind you, it was long before the Mongol expansion and Arabs didn't have any contacts with Mongols in those times anyway.



Sahih Bukhari : Read, Study, Search Online
Turkics and Mongoloids lived side by side for thousends of years.Its normal they had some mongoloid features.Not to mention there were Turko-Mongol tribes and states over there.

I heard about this quote before.Another quote which i dont remember the source at the moment tells about Turkic hegemony over earth for the second time.I say the first one was Huns era or Ottoman era.Beware,you others.Wait for the second one!
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Old December 10th, 2012, 08:01 PM   #428
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Yugurs are "Yellow Uygurs" and they are genetically same peoples with the Uyghurs from Sincan.They followed different ways after they fled from Mongolia and they settled different places.This doesnt make them unrelated peoples.
Karluk are also related to Uygurs.Mahmud al-Kashgari in his Divânu Lügati't-Türk said that "Karluk is the name of a nomadic tribes of Turks.They are different than Oghuz but they are Turkmens just like Oghuz Turks.
Karluks joined to Gokturks in 682 and later to Uyghurs in 745.They changed the name to Karakhanid after adopting Islam religion.Karluks are the first Turkics that adopted Islam.

From my point of wiev all Turkics behind Caspian Sea are more or less mongolid except Turkmenistan.They are mostly caucasians.I think Sincan Uygurs can hardly pass as caucasians.


I didnt know that.Need to search more about it.Btw im not Kemalist but im Turanist.One doesnt need to be Kemalist to love Ataturk.


Basicly,
Ottomans--> Seljuks-->Oghuz Yabghu Khaganate-->Khazars

Oghuz Yabghu Khaganate was a part of Khazar Empire.After Kievan Rus defated Khazars,Oghuz Yabghu state became independent.Seljuk Bey was one of the clan leaders and he was from Kınık branch of Oghuz Turks.He converted to Islam,rejected his Shamanist brothers and he drove his clans to south areas,ME and Anatolia.

Khazar is the name of a Turkic confederation which includes Uyghurs,Proto-Bulgars,Sabirs and Pecheneks according to Jewish,Greek and Arab sources.They were part of Huns.The Khazars were a Turkic tribe that roamed the steppes from Northern China to the Black Sea. Between the 7th and 10th centuries they conquered huge swaths of what is now southern Russia and Ukraine, the Caucasus Mountains and Central Asia as far as the Aral Sea.


As you can see Turkic peoples are all related to each other somehow.The starting point is Altai and Siberia.
Modern "uyghurs" called themselves turki before 1921, or by the oasis they came from like kashgari from kashgar. When the soviet puppet sheng shicai first implemented the soviet union's nationality police in xinjiang and started calling the turki people "uyghur", "uyghur" pan turkists like Mehmet emin bughra and Masud Sabri thought that it was a soviet plot to divide turkic peoples in xinjiang. They never heard of this name "uyghur" before that. They called themselves turki or turkestani.

I didn't say that karluks are not related to ancient uyghurs. I am saying that modern uyghurs are not directly descended from the ancient uyghur khaganate, modern uyghur are directly descended from karluk kara khanids. Kashgar was rule by the kara khanids, not the uyghur khaganate.
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Old December 13th, 2012, 06:02 AM   #429
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Originally Posted by Ayazid View Post
Fine, so how would you explain this Arab account from the 9th century which clearly describes Turks as having mongoloid features? Mind you, it was long before the Mongol expansion and Arabs didn't have any contacts with Mongols in those times anyway.



Sahih Bukhari : Read, Study, Search Online
I know this account but many times hadith is not that unreliable.

so it is possible that this is 7th century saying of muhammad and he merely said what he had heard from gossip.

I can show you quotes from European travellers witnessing cannibalism in areas where vegetarianism was the norm.
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Old December 13th, 2012, 01:33 PM   #430

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Originally Posted by avantivarman View Post
I know this account but many times hadith is not that unreliable.

so it is possible that this is 7th century saying of muhammad and he merely said what he had heard from gossip.

I can show you quotes from European travellers witnessing cannibalism in areas where vegetarianism was the norm.
The point here is not if this hadith is an authentic prophecy of Muhammad (which I highly doubt), but that it documents how Arabs in the 9th century (when it was written down) imagined the appearance of Central Asian Turks. They were clearly mongoloid. Furthermore, the person who included this narration in his collection, Muhammad al-Bukhari, was a Central Asian himself, so he knew how Turks in those times looked like.
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