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View Poll Results: Are the Pakistanis Indians?
Pakistanis are culturally Indian. 13 11.11%
Pakistanis aren't culturally Indian. 24 20.51%
Pakistanis are culturally and historically Indian. 63 53.85%
Pakistanis aren't culturally and historically Indian. 17 14.53%
Voters: 117. You may not vote on this poll

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Old January 1st, 2018, 06:25 AM   #781

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Originally Posted by Joshua A View Post
It's a silly poll.

Pakistan is historically Indian. That is the Pakistani people are genetically Indian and historically were a part of the Indic civilization. Culturally it maintains many of Indian features re language, but it tilts more strongly in favour of Arabic culture even in language, it retains most of the Urdu and Persian loan words, the cuisine is more Arabic, and the religion is of course Arabic - Islam. Pakistani's also feel a stronger civilizational connect with Arabia.

Pakistan was formed as the antithesis of Hindu India. This is probably where it gets its name sake "Pakistan" meaning the pure land i.e., one free of Hindu religion.

I don't think Indians feel much connect with the Pakistani people, including Indian Muslims.
Welcome back, after a long time , my friend ! And a very clear cut post as usual. A very happy, healthy and prosperous new year 2018 to you !
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Old January 1st, 2018, 07:03 AM   #782
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Old January 1st, 2018, 07:47 AM   #783

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Originally Posted by rvsakhadeo View Post
Welcome back, after a long time , my friend ! And a very clear cut post as usual. A very happy, healthy and prosperous new year 2018 to you !
That post is from 2015. He hasn't been active since March 2016 according to this profile.
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Old January 1st, 2018, 08:00 AM   #784

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Originally Posted by tornada View Post
Going by a purely east west axis, it would arguably be more to the west than Gandhara.
The people of Gedrosia (Mekran) in Alexander's time were more Indic than Iranic. The mud-wells near Gwadar were known in his time as 'Rama Koopa' (Lord Rama Chandra's wells). Even now they are called "Chandra Kup'.
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Old January 1st, 2018, 08:15 AM   #785
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Originally Posted by Aupmanyav View Post
Most Pakistanis are Indic rather than Iranic.
True, but Iranics are still a good 20% of the population. Even though I don't consider non-Indic Pakistanis to be really Pakistani, that is not the de facto view so questions like this seem to be denying the existence of Iranics living in Pakistan. But I guess I'll vote 'yes' since my position has been clarified in the thread a few times.

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Yes, though at times, Kapisha, Kabul and Kandhar had Hindu kings
Do we know for sure these kings were Indian? The Kabul Shahi dynasty for example was said to have been founded/ruled by Tibetans.

Also, Hindu was at times a generic term for polytheists and did not necessarily correspond to the modern definition of Hindu.
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Old January 3rd, 2018, 04:40 AM   #786

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Originally Posted by Dzmeka View Post
Do we know for sure these kings were Indian? The Kabul Shahi dynasty for example was said to have been founded/ruled by Tibetans.

Also, Hindu was at times a generic term for polytheists and did not necessarily correspond to the modern definition of Hindu.
You are right. Nearly all invaders in history prior to Islam got absorbed in Hinduism with its labrynth of beliefs which range from animism to non-duality ('advaita') whether they were Greeks, Parthians, Sakas, Kushanas, Hunas. It is impossible to define Hinduism except as a Open Source religion, like Linux, hundreds of distributions.

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Old January 3rd, 2018, 05:35 AM   #787

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Originally Posted by tornada View Post
That post is from 2015. He hasn't been active since March 2016 according to this profile.
Oops ! I did not look at the date of the post ! In fact I was then puzzled a bit because AFAIK, he had been banned by the mods sometime back, I do not remember for what period .
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Old January 3rd, 2018, 10:59 PM   #788

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They were Indians till very recently (1947).
70 years is not a long time in history.
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Old January 3rd, 2018, 11:46 PM   #789
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Originally Posted by Suratrana View Post
Pakistanis are not Indian. they were once upon a time an Indic people before being conquered brutally by turks,arab etc . since then they have internalized the arab supremacy that islam extols and genuinely see themselves as arabs, even though pure arabs despise them and Bangladeshis. Indians reside within the borders of republic of India. simplest explanation really.
Wrong, they don't see themselves as Arabs at all. You're just making that up because you don't like that they deny their Indianness. The only people I have seen in South Asia that always claim foreign ancestry in very large percentages are India's Muslims, and they consider themselves Pathan not Arab. I don't know why they never get called out for doing that.

But anyways, Pakistanis see themselves as Indic/Desi, but not Indian. In reality, both are synonyms but they tend to think of Indian as a national identity not an ethnic one. They often identify as Desi but get offended when being called Indian because they have a different view of the definition of Indian.
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Old January 3rd, 2018, 11:51 PM   #790
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Originally Posted by Aupmanyav View Post
They were Indians till very recently (1947).
70 years is not a long time in history.
They still are Indians (ethnic Indians) today. The confusion results because people from India try to portray Indian as an ethnic and national identity at the same time. Most Northeast Indians are Sino-Tibetans and not Indics/Desis (ethnic Indians) but they get called Indian, so it creates a confusion on whether an Indian is someone with an Indian passport or someone of Indic origin.

Also, Sri Lankans and Nepalis are ethnic Indian but people from India never claim them as Indians like they do with Pakistanis. I'm guessing this is done because Indians don't want to hurt their relationship with those people, but it creates confusion when you only claim someone as Indian based on the political boundaries of the British Raj (Pakistan, India, Bangladesh) instead of calling someone an Indian based on being Indic/Desi (the original definition of Indian).

Last edited by Dzmeka; January 3rd, 2018 at 11:54 PM.
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