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Old July 23rd, 2017, 03:49 AM   #1
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Women's contributions to Flemish and Dutch history and culture


The Dutch and Flemish females we most remember today are probably the sweet-faced, rosy-cheeked girls and ladies who appear in the paintings of the Masters, going about their daily activities in glowing serenity. The great majority of these females belonged to the lower or middle social classes; almost all of them are anonymous. Yet, in both Flanders and the Netherlands, there were numerous erudite women who contributed actively and skillfully to intellectual and scientific pursuits: brilliant female authors, artists, musicians, researchers, and scholars whose achievements, unfortunately, have been mostly forgotten today except in their native lands.

Can you name some of these worthy females, and tell about their participation in the history and culture of the Low Countries?
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 01:27 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by reitia View Post
The Dutch and Flemish females we most remember today are probably the sweet-faced, rosy-cheeked girls and ladies who appear in the paintings of the Masters, going about their daily activities in glowing serenity. The great majority of these females belonged to the lower or middle social classes; almost all of them are anonymous. Yet, in both Flanders and the Netherlands, there were numerous erudite women who contributed actively and skillfully to intellectual and scientific pursuits: brilliant female authors, artists, musicians, researchers, and scholars whose achievements, unfortunately, have been mostly forgotten today except in their native lands.

Can you name some of these worthy females, and tell about their participation in the history and culture of the Low Countries?

Reitia,

"Can you name some of these worthy females, and tell about their participation in the history and culture of the Low Countries?"

One that I still remember from my Dutch literature history:
https://www.britannica.com/biography...van-der-Schalk
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henriette_Roland_Holst
After some sixty years I still remember a famous quote from one of her poems:
"Ik die had kameraadschap uitgegeven..."
(I who had given out companionship,fellowship, cameraderie...)
From 1912, I guess about her difficulties with the communist party...
I am not a communist, far from it, but I liked her "passion". Quite another kettle of fish than her Fascist counterparts, which emerged only some years later...
For Willempie as it is all in Dutch but the originals!
http://www.dbnl.org/tekst/stui002hen...2henr01_01.pdf
Page 24 item 80.
http://www.dbnl.org/arch/rola003vrou...3vrou01_01.pdf
Page 46.

Kind regards, Paul.
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 01:42 PM   #3
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And Reitia,

I just mentioned on another small English language history board three valuable women at the start of the Dutch revolt in the Low Countries of that time, including a fourth from England, third wife of the last Burgundian duke: Charles the Bold: Margaret of York
https://reshistorica.historyboard.ne...day-in-history

"Nielsen, while I did research about Isabella I came again on one of my favourite women...what a woman...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_of_York
Sister of Edward IV and Richard III (Minette where are you?)
she was fully intertwined with the so-called War of the Roses. My last book from the local library that I read during the kidney dialysis was about this War of the Roses and I commented it overhere...
Step grand grand mother of Charles V and third wife of Charles the Bold, duke of Burgundy.
From the wiki:
Although the marriage produced no children, Margaret proved a valuable asset to Burgundy. Immediately after her wedding, she journeyed with her stepdaughter Mary through Flanders, Brabant and Hainaut, visiting the great towns: Ursel, Ghent, Dendermonde, Asse, Brussels, Oudenaarde and Kortrijk were all impressed by her intelligence and capability.
Also from the wiki:
It was in the wake of her husband's death that Margaret proved truly invaluable to Burgundy. She had always been regarded as a skilful and intelligent politician; now, she went beyond even that. To her stepdaughter, Mary, now Duchess of Burgundy, she gave immeasurable guidance and help: using her own experiences in the court of Edward IV, where she had largely avoided being used as a pawn and contributed to the arrangement of her own marriage, she wisely guided the Duchess in deciding her marriage; against the wave of marriage offers that flooded to the two Duchesses in Ghent (from the recently widowed Duke of Clarence, from the 7-year old Dauphin of France, Charles, from a brother of Edward IV's wife, Elizabeth Woodville), she stood firm, and advised Mary to marry Maximilian of Habsburg, the 18-year-old son of the Holy Roman Emperor Frederick III, to whom Charles the Bold had betrothed Mary, and who was ambitious and active enough, in Margaret's opinion, to defend Mary's legacy."


About the "Regentessen of the Netherlands" I read the three books of Jane de Iongh:
Dr.Jane de Iongh; De Hertogin; de Madama; De Koningin - MarktPlaza.nl
The three "regentessen" (governesses?) of the Netherlands:
The Duchess: Margaret of Austria, Duchess of Savoie
Madama: Margaret of Austria, Duchess of Parma and Piacenza (we call her Margaret of Parma)
The Queen: Mary of Hungary, Governess (Landvoogdes) of the Netherlands.

I found something in English about Jane de Iongh:
https://www.librarything.com/author/ionghjanede

She was women for women...


Short biographyAdriana Wilhelmina de Iongh, called "Jane," and her brother were the children of an artistic family. She studied literature at the University of Amsterdam, with the Italian Renaissance as her doctoral thesis topic in 1924. After graduation, she got a job as a librarian at the Netherlands Economic History Archive (NEHA). She belonged to the small group of professional historians in the Netherlands during the interwar period. In 1935, Jane de Iongh resigned as librarian of the NEHA, to become a board member of both the International Institute of Social History and the International Archives for the Women's Movement (now IIAV). She studied the women's movement and conducted research in Britain and France. In 1936 she published a book that criticized the traditional, prejudiced view of women's role in history as that of wife or lover of a famous man. Jane was a member of the Dutch Society for Women's Interests and Equal Citizenship and the Women's Group of the Liberal Party. In the second half of the 1930s, as she frequently published articles in Dutch periodicals, Jane de Iongh developed into a well-known and respected personality. She worked also for more complete citizenship rights for women. During the German Occupation, she helped fulfill the need for cultural and historical works about the patriotic past by writing two biographies of the great female Regents of the Netherlands in the 16th-century: Margaret of Austria and Maria (or Mary) of Hungary. Her books offered a new interpretation of the political history of the Netherlands. Shortly after the Liberation, Jane de Iongh was named attaché for Education, Arts and Sciences in London, a position she would hold for 10 years. In the 1950s, in ailing health, she lived for a while in the south of French while she completed work on the biography of the third great female ruler of the Netherlands, Margaret, Duchess of Parma and Piacenza.And but in Dutch but there is a photograph Click the image to open in full size.
Iongh, Adriana Willemina de (1901-1982)


And:
goo.gl/m7gnqt

The monstrous regiment of women...

Kind regards, Paul.
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 10:04 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulRyckier View Post
And Reitia,

I just mentioned on another small English language history board three valuable women at the start of the Dutch revolt in the Low Countries of that time, including a fourth from England, third wife of the last Burgundian duke: Charles the Bold: Margaret of York
https://reshistorica.historyboard.ne...day-in-history

"Nielsen, while I did research about Isabella I came again on one of my favourite women...what a woman...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_of_York
Sister of Edward IV and Richard III (Minette where are you?)
she was fully intertwined with the so-called War of the Roses. My last book from the local library that I read during the kidney dialysis was about this War of the Roses and I commented it overhere...
Step grand grand mother of Charles V and third wife of Charles the Bold, duke of Burgundy.
From the wiki:
Although the marriage produced no children, Margaret proved a valuable asset to Burgundy. Immediately after her wedding, she journeyed with her stepdaughter Mary through Flanders, Brabant and Hainaut, visiting the great towns: Ursel, Ghent, Dendermonde, Asse, Brussels, Oudenaarde and Kortrijk were all impressed by her intelligence and capability.
Also from the wiki:
It was in the wake of her husband's death that Margaret proved truly invaluable to Burgundy. She had always been regarded as a skilful and intelligent politician; now, she went beyond even that. To her stepdaughter, Mary, now Duchess of Burgundy, she gave immeasurable guidance and help: using her own experiences in the court of Edward IV, where she had largely avoided being used as a pawn and contributed to the arrangement of her own marriage, she wisely guided the Duchess in deciding her marriage; against the wave of marriage offers that flooded to the two Duchesses in Ghent (from the recently widowed Duke of Clarence, from the 7-year old Dauphin of France, Charles, from a brother of Edward IV's wife, Elizabeth Woodville), she stood firm, and advised Mary to marry Maximilian of Habsburg, the 18-year-old son of the Holy Roman Emperor Frederick III, to whom Charles the Bold had betrothed Mary, and who was ambitious and active enough, in Margaret's opinion, to defend Mary's legacy."


About the "Regentessen of the Netherlands" I read the three books of Jane de Iongh:
Dr.Jane de Iongh; De Hertogin; de Madama; De Koningin - MarktPlaza.nl
The three "regentessen" (governesses?) of the Netherlands:
The Duchess: Margaret of Austria, Duchess of Savoie
Madama: Margaret of Austria, Duchess of Parma and Piacenza (we call her Margaret of Parma)
The Queen: Mary of Hungary, Governess (Landvoogdes) of the Netherlands.

I found something in English about Jane de Iongh:
https://www.librarything.com/author/ionghjanede

She was women for women...


Short biographyAdriana Wilhelmina de Iongh, called "Jane," and her brother were the children of an artistic family. She studied literature at the University of Amsterdam, with the Italian Renaissance as her doctoral thesis topic in 1924. After graduation, she got a job as a librarian at the Netherlands Economic History Archive (NEHA). She belonged to the small group of professional historians in the Netherlands during the interwar period. In 1935, Jane de Iongh resigned as librarian of the NEHA, to become a board member of both the International Institute of Social History and the International Archives for the Women's Movement (now IIAV). She studied the women's movement and conducted research in Britain and France. In 1936 she published a book that criticized the traditional, prejudiced view of women's role in history as that of wife or lover of a famous man. Jane was a member of the Dutch Society for Women's Interests and Equal Citizenship and the Women's Group of the Liberal Party. In the second half of the 1930s, as she frequently published articles in Dutch periodicals, Jane de Iongh developed into a well-known and respected personality. She worked also for more complete citizenship rights for women. During the German Occupation, she helped fulfill the need for cultural and historical works about the patriotic past by writing two biographies of the great female Regents of the Netherlands in the 16th-century: Margaret of Austria and Maria (or Mary) of Hungary. Her books offered a new interpretation of the political history of the Netherlands. Shortly after the Liberation, Jane de Iongh was named attaché for Education, Arts and Sciences in London, a position she would hold for 10 years. In the 1950s, in ailing health, she lived for a while in the south of French while she completed work on the biography of the third great female ruler of the Netherlands, Margaret, Duchess of Parma and Piacenza.And but in Dutch but there is a photograph Click the image to open in full size.
Iongh, Adriana Willemina de (1901-1982)


And:
goo.gl/m7gnqt

The monstrous regiment of women...

Kind regards, Paul.
Thanks, Paul. These are interesting facts which I didn't know before. There is so much history to learn...

Could you please recommend some excellent books, in English, French or Italian, which deal with the history and culture of the Low Countries from the Middle Ages to the end of the 17th century? This is the period I am currently researching. In Italy, it's not easy to find specialized works on this subject.
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Old July 24th, 2017, 01:39 PM   #5
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Reitia,

"Could you please recommend some excellent books, in English, French or Italian, which deal with the history and culture of the Low Countries from the Middle Ages to the end of the 17th century? This is the period I am currently researching. In Italy, it's not easy to find specialized works on this subject."

Will do it tomorow, had a discussion with Deaftuner this evening and now too late on the European peninsula....

Kind regards from Paul.
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Old July 25th, 2017, 02:29 AM   #6

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There is not that much. Belle van Zuylen, Hadewych and Maria van Oosterwijck are the first that come to mind
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Old July 26th, 2017, 12:48 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulRyckier View Post
Reitia,

"Could you please recommend some excellent books, in English, French or Italian, which deal with the history and culture of the Low Countries from the Middle Ages to the end of the 17th century? This is the period I am currently researching. In Italy, it's not easy to find specialized works on this subject."

Will do it tomorow, had a discussion with Deaftuner this evening and now too late on the European peninsula....

Kind regards from Paul.
Reitia,

a first one in English:
https://www.amazon.com/History-Count.../dp/0230293107

Kind regards, Paul.
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Old July 26th, 2017, 12:57 PM   #8
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Addendum to the previous message.

Reitia, I think a bit difficult and less interesting for you, but for the true scholars...

https://www.amazon.com/History-Low-C.../dp/1845452720

Kind regards, Paul.
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Old July 27th, 2017, 02:47 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulRyckier View Post
Addendum to the previous message.

Reitia, I think a bit difficult and less interesting for you, but for the true scholars...

https://www.amazon.com/History-Low-C.../dp/1845452720

Kind regards, Paul.
I am a researcher, and aspire to be a true scholar. For me, the more specialized and detailed a book is, the more likely it is to be a gold mine of precious information.

So I look forward to reading this book which you've mentioned.

I've just posted a thread called "Freethinkers in the Netherlands". Could you please help me with this one, too? I'm trying to put together a coherent picture of the mutual influences between liberal philosophers like Spinoza and the great social activists of the Netherlands' Golden Age.

Tot ziens...Until the next post...
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Old July 28th, 2017, 05:22 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Willempie View Post
There is not that much. Belle van Zuylen, Hadewych and Maria van Oosterwijck are the first that come to mind
Thank you Willempie for these references.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isabel...Charri%C3%A8re
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maria_van_Oosterwijck

What one learns all on these boards...

Kind regards from Paul.
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