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Old August 24th, 2017, 05:22 AM   #1
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Russian people- better off under the Tsar?


Using the death and oppression of the Russian Revolution and the murderous Bolshevik rule as a guide, I put to you the Russian people would have been far better off if the Tsar had remained in power.


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Old August 24th, 2017, 06:27 AM   #2
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I have tremendous respect for the Cassandras who warned people of the calamities communism would bring when the world was bewildered by the Revolution. I also admire the emigres who had the foresight to leave for good.
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Old August 24th, 2017, 07:58 AM   #3

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I believe that many Russians lamented the fall of the Tsar after the rise of the Bosheviks, given that the Bolsheviks returned the country to the situation before the reforms of 1905.. Maybe we can be enlightened by some of our Russian comrades?
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Old August 24th, 2017, 08:00 AM   #4

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They would have been better off, if not least due to there being no civil war which killed vast numbers. Industrialization would perhaps have been slower without it being vigorously pushed by Stalin, but eventually market forces would have dictated that changes be made. No revolution would have meant no ideological head to head between Nazi Germany and Russia, though I'm sure Hitler would still have been thinking of lebensraum. But in this scenario of no civil war, would Hitler even have found a party to lead, and I'm basing saying that on the help given to the early Nazis by expatriate Whites, who of course would never have fled to Germany in the first place.

Where Russia would be today, let alone the world, with the Romanov's surviving is impossible to gauge, though the standard of living would probably not be any different than it is now, people would still have autos and tech things and foreign holidays. It would of course be hoped that in this scenario, 28 million people who died in the Soviet Union would not have died, but we'll never know, and those deaths were the fault of Hitler, not the system in Soviet Union or Russia in this fictional scenario.

Last edited by Corvidius; August 24th, 2017 at 08:59 AM.
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Old August 24th, 2017, 09:02 AM   #5

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Of course they'd be better off. At the begining of the 20th century we see a process of slow democratisation in Russia. Things would slowly change for the better. But then the commies came and started with their failed policies that only brought a lot more death, political violence and starvation after the Great War and the civil war. Everyone would be better off without the commies than with them, not just the Russians.
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Old August 24th, 2017, 09:51 AM   #6

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shtajerc View Post
. . . . Everyone would be better off without the commies than with them, not just the Russians.
Amen! Sad that a lot of young people don't see it that way, probably because they haven't any experience of the world and don't know history.
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Old August 24th, 2017, 09:51 AM   #7
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if there is no february and then no october revolutions and Russia continue to be in the war until the end, how would Europe look like? Would there be an independent Poland, Finland, Baltic states? what were the Entente plans before 1917, what would Russia gain in case of victory? I assume Galicia would go to them from Austria-Hungary. Other gains?
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Old August 24th, 2017, 10:05 AM   #8

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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Vagamundo View Post
I believe that many Russians lamented the fall of the Tsar after the rise of the Bosheviks, given that the Bolsheviks returned the country to the situation before the reforms of 1905.. Maybe we can be enlightened by some of our Russian comrades?
No, Russians didn't lament the death of Tsar. Neither Red, nor White - known fact. Between us, this Tsar was total a.h.. It were not Bolsheviks that overthrew the Tsar, it were his own entourage, which understood that better without tsar than with him. One can't say that some government would be better than Soviets. There were probed dozens of them but no one was successful but Soviets.
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Old August 24th, 2017, 11:51 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by comtedeloach View Post
Using the death and oppression of the Russian Revolution and the murderous Bolshevik rule as a guide, I put to you the Russian people would have been far better off if the Tsar had remained in power.


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I've little interest in Russia so don't know a great deal, but what I can say is that many Russian soldiers during WW1 had never heard of a country called Germany and went to war bare footed and lacking a gun. That could be a decent yardstick.
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Old August 24th, 2017, 12:02 PM   #10

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I've little interest in Russia so don't know a great deal, but what I can say is that many Russian soldiers during WW1 had never heard of a country called Germany and went to war bare footed and lacking a gun. That could be a decent yardstick.
With such a knowledge you must be a PdD in history
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