Did Christianity save Europe from the dark ages? - Page 3 - Historum

**Solidaire** · April 26th, 2012, 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yaunâ

But I thought that the library of Constantinople was created by the state.

Of course it was. But wasn't the state and the Church one in Byzantium (being a theocracy)? At least the Church tolerated it, and wasn't hard bent on 'burning' the ancient manuscripts.

Yaunâ · April 26th, 2012, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solidaire

Of course it was. But wasn't the state and the Church one in Byzantium (being a theocracy)? At least the Church tolerated it, and wasn't hard bent on 'burning' the ancient manuscripts.

In Byzantium nobody was tolerating anyone actually, although it was some kind of theocracy, meaning that the state was influenced by religion of course (indirectly through the Church) but the Church didn't have any authority upon the state or the secular issues

**unclefred** · April 26th, 2012, 08:05 AM

Go ye Saint Patrick! Cabbage and bacon!

**DreamWeaver** · April 26th, 2012, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 0311USM

I tought the overall perception was that the deterioration of the old system led to the end of the Dark Ages. More precisely the Roman Empire and it's grip.
I highly doubt Christianity can get any credit for something it likely caused to begin with.

What a ridiculous graph

**Iolo** · April 26th, 2012, 08:37 AM

My own feeling is that the classical world - because of slavery and various other influences - was at a technological dead end and had to, so to speak, step back and re-organise the mode of production into early feudalism. Meanwhile the Church (or rather churches) preserved much of the culture and Islam some of the science. I can't see how much could have survived without 'religion'. How much do we really know, for instance, about pre-Christian 'England'? Without some sort of literary scholarship, what is there before archaeology and genetics?

0311USM · April 26th, 2012, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Young Guard

We have to thank you Christianity for saving historical events and texts written by monks and historians during the dark ages. Without them we won't have a clear understanding about the dark ages.

You can also thank monks for using Archimedes' works as scrap paper for a bible.

**DreamWeaver** · April 26th, 2012, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 0311USM

You can also thank monks for using Archimedes' works as scrap paper for a bible.

Which means we still have them, older documents recycled into book bindings and covers are relatively common.

**Belloc** · April 26th, 2012, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreamWeaver

What a ridiculous graph

Yeah I must add to the consensus here concerning the graph. I see there's no comparative decline of scientific advancement measured for the end of Bronze Age civilization.

0311USM · April 26th, 2012, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Louise C

That graph is totally unfair. The middle ages was not an era of cultural stagnation. Universities were founded, literature and flourished, there was amazing architecture, and technological advances as well.

Golden age of Islam took place during that same time sure...
Arabs theorizing about splitting atoms and Europeans launching crusade after crusade in search of holy wood believed to be the part of the "true cross."

Advances did take place...just not in Europe.

**DreamWeaver** · April 26th, 2012, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Belloc

Yeah I must add to the consensus here concerning the graph. I see there's no comparative decline of scientific advancement measured for the end of Bronze Age civilization.

What unit of measurement does one measure sceintific advancement in?

Also since these are apparently "Christian Dark Ages" if one was not a Chrisitan, one doesnt have a dark age. Where is their spurious grpah?