 | | European History European History Forum - Western and Eastern Europe including the British Isles, Scandinavia, Russia |
April 27th, 2012, 01:09 AM
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#41 | | Rabbit of Wormhole
Joined: Mar 2012 From: In the bag of ecstatic squirt Posts: 7,877 | | | |
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April 28th, 2012, 05:59 AM
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#42 | | Historian
Joined: Apr 2010 From: Loch na Seilg, Alba Posts: 2,589 |
Arab scholars and inventors deserve a lot of credit for the things they did introduce, but to characterise a thousand years of European history as savages in mud huts is just plain wrong. Europeans could and did produce spectacular works of art, literature, and science in this time period. To write that off completely is amateurish.
Also, ever heard of the Hiberno-Scottish mission? I recommend Thomas Cahill's How the Irish Saved Europe for a (non-academic) introduction to the topic.
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April 28th, 2012, 07:03 AM
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#43 | | Historian
Joined: Jan 2011 From: Southeast England Posts: 5,489 | Quote:
Originally Posted by Ri Fhionngaill Arab scholars and inventors deserve a lot of credit for the things they did introduce, but to characterise a thousand years of European history as savages in mud huts is just plain wrong. Europeans could and did produce spectacular works of art, literature, and science in this time period. To write that off completely is amateurish.
Also, ever heard of the Hiberno-Scottish mission? I recommend Thomas Cahill's How the Irish Saved Europe for a (non-academic) introduction to the topic. | That Thomas Cahill book is good.
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April 29th, 2012, 12:04 PM
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#44 | | Archivist
Joined: Aug 2011 From: Montreal, Canada Posts: 177 | Quote:
Originally Posted by Louise C That Thomas Cahill book is good. | That book really makes you wonder how a few monks managed to keep alive some of the most crucial knowledge of mankind. It screws with my head just thinking about it.
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April 29th, 2012, 07:11 PM
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#45 | | Scholar
Joined: Mar 2011 Posts: 532 |
The spread of Christianity definitely did its part in pacifying the continent and stopping the endless infighting and raids by various pagan tribes, such as the Vikings, Magyars and others. The adoption of Christianity included a political commitment towards Church authorities throughout the continent and this made it harder to go to war against someone simply because you wanted to. At the same time, Christianity encouraged stronger central rule since that also benefited the Church. Stronger central rule meant better administration and consequently also more tax revenues and more development. Later on, Christianity also turned out to be a convenient political platform through which serious threats such as those posed by Muslims and Mongols could be dealt with, though that's technically beyond the "Dark Ages" (which are usually said to last no later/longer than AD 1000). So, yes, I think that Christianity definitely played a vital role in bringing Europe out of the so called "Dark Ages", though it's more correct to call this period the Early Middle Ages.
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April 29th, 2012, 07:13 PM
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#46 | | Citizen
Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 10 | Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake10 Though it gave power to a few individuals, I think all literature, art, technology and science would have been lost without the church. Can we attribute Europe's rebound to Christianity? | You know, I've heard it stated that the Church preserved literacy in Europe, and quite frankly I'm tempted to agree.
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April 29th, 2012, 07:20 PM
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#47 | | Scholar
Joined: Mar 2011 Posts: 532 | Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor Imperialism Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake10 Though it gave power to a few individuals, I think all literature, art, technology and science would have been lost without the church. Can we attribute Europe's rebound to Christianity? | You know, I've heard it stated that the Church preserved literacy in Europe, and quite frankly I'm tempted to agree. | Although Europe's rebound strictly speaking would occur only after the "Dark Ages" (post-AD 1000), one wouldn't of course be able to understand the underlying causes of the rebound without looking back at the "Dark Ages".
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May 7th, 2012, 01:14 AM
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#48 | | Citizen
Joined: May 2012 Posts: 5 | Dark age graph
Really good graph, shows the way christianity supressed any original thought or diversion from the written 'truth' of the bible. Christianity took along time to take hold, it is still growing in places, so we cannot say everything, like the sacking of Rome, was due to it. But we must all agree the christian established Church suppressed scientific progress. If you were sure the world was round, would you risk persecution by saying it??
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May 7th, 2012, 01:49 AM
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#49 | | Historian
Joined: Jan 2011 From: Southeast England Posts: 5,489 | Quote:
Originally Posted by mancman Really good graph, shows the way christianity supressed any original thought or diversion from the written 'truth' of the bible. Christianity took along time to take hold, it is still growing in places, so we cannot say everything, like the sacking of Rome, was due to it. But we must all agree the christian established Church suppressed scientific progress. If you were sure the world was round, would you risk persecution by saying it?? | Medieval people knew perfectly well that the world was round. It is a myth that they did not. And the church did not suppress all scientific progress. There were some notable churchmen who were scientists themselves, like Roger Bacon for example. That graph is quite nonsensical.
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May 7th, 2012, 01:56 AM
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#50 | | Lecturer
Joined: Jul 2011 Posts: 444 | Quote:
Originally Posted by Louise C Medieval people knew perfectly well that the world was round. It is a myth that they did not. And the church did not suppress all scientific progress. There were some notable churchmen who were scientists themselves, like Roger Bacon for example. That graph is quite nonsensical. | Couldn't agree more
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