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Old July 13th, 2017, 02:25 PM   #101
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It's a mix of many

Latvians and Lithuanians are Balts (not Balkans). They are Baltic tribes living on Baltic Sea. The culture is original, unlike Germanic, Slavic or Finnic, although has influences from as far as Portugal, Greece, Italy and even Japan.

Regarding linguistics, I found about several hundred words from Slavic languages, some from common ancient root when PIE was one language and some from living next door to Alice.

I find Lithuanian language similarities with the following languages:

Latvian - the most

Finnic and Germanic - the least, but there are some shared words

Slavic - there are at least several hundred shared words and grammatic similarities, thus at least 1% to 3% similarity

Greek, Sanskrit/Hindi/Urdu - quite significant similarities in ancent words

French, Italian, Portuguese, Latin - quite significant similarity in words and ancient traditions

To my observation, Lithuanian and Latvian are neither Kentum neither Satem languages as they have almost equal amounts of commonality with Slavic, Germanic and Latin, Geek vocabulary. Thus they are Central European languages, situated between East and West.


Latin: óvis
Lithuanian: avěs
Russian: ovtsá
Portuguese: ovelha (ovélya) Lithuanian diminutive for sheep is avélé

Italian: sole
French: soleil
Lithuanian: saulé
Russian: sólntse

English: grind (i suspect relation to pavement)
Lithuanian: grindinys, gatvé
Russian: gat'
Swedish: gatan (street)

English: chair
Portuguese: cadeira
Lithuanian: kédé

English: hill
Russian: kholm
Lithuanian: kalva (kalnas)
Portuguese: colina

English: hanger
Lithuanian: pakaba (kabeti = to hang)
Portuguese: cabide

English: dick
Portuguese: carálho (karalyu)
Lithuanian: karálius (king)

English: wood, timber
Portuguese: madeira
Lithuanian: mediena

English: to piss, take a leak
Lithuanian: myzhti (myzhu = i am taking a leak)
Portuguese: mijo (meezhu)

Finnish: laiva
Lithuanian: laivas
English: ship, boat

Finnish: kirves
Lithuanian: kirvis (kirst = to cut)
English: axe

English: to bruise
Lithuanian: brúzh-

English: perk
Lithuanian: perk- (to buy, perhaps to bargain)


Some weird "similarities" between Lithaunian and Japanese:

Japanese: katai, kanda, tooi, oppai, wakai
Lithuanian: kietai, kanda, tóli, papai, vaikai

Most vocabulary in Baltic languages though is not similar with any other European languages suggesting that they only have ancient relation with the rest of Europeans as well as modern internationalized words.

Last edited by Spindesys; July 13th, 2017 at 02:32 PM.
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Old July 13th, 2017, 11:56 PM   #102
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They're basically slavo-nordic. Or more like how original slavs were.
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Old July 14th, 2017, 04:03 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by Bophis View Post
They're basically slavo-nordic. Or more like how original slavs were.
Yes and no, and only if the following is true:

Greeks would then be called Turko-Latins
Kazakhs as Sino-Germanic
Portuguese as Germano-Semitic
Amazigh as Afro-Latins
Germans as Franco-Poles or Slavo-Latins

Balts are just Balts and nothing else, except a certain percentage that are mixed with others in the recent history. It's a distinct group without any dashes. You can not say that Aminata Savadogo is a typical Latvian slavo-nordic Balt, but someone like Janis Slavomirskis perhaps is.
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Old December 26th, 2017, 11:36 PM   #104
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Latvians removed all Germanisms from their language during codification of literary language replacing them with Lithuanian words or neologisms. Lithuanians did the same removing Slavism replacing them with Latvian words or neologisms.

Germans and Latvians did not mix at all. Germans were upper class, while Latvians were serfs in general . Maybe harsh to hear. That's how it was. If Latvians entered upper class society , eventually they'd adopt Germanic culture and language. There is architectural influence in Riga. Eastern Latvia , Latgale lacks any Germanic influence. In fact, they don't even share the same religion with the rest of Latvians. Latvians are Lutherans,Latgalians are Roman Catholic.

Livland was purchased by Russian empire in 1721. Latgale and Curland joined Russian in 1795 - these are on territories of modern day Latvia. They remained in Russian empire till 1917. Then in Soviet Union between 1940 and 1991. Really, Latvia as an independent state existed between 1917-1940. In modern days between 1991-till present. Their Germanic influence is more of a wishful thinking.

On the other hand Lithuania has a long history of having its own independent state. Since 1253 till 1795 as a Grand Duchy of Lithuania. Then between 1917-1940.

Last edited by lexell; December 26th, 2017 at 11:42 PM.
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Old December 27th, 2017, 12:00 AM   #105

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If one take the language of the people as a guide , the three Baltics are three distinct people
a layer of German aristocracy was stripped away by the Soviet period ,while two hundred years of Russian administration didn't take root in

Each country has had it's own historical development ,
Lithuania has a solid claim to have fought ferociously for their identity
while the independence of Latvia and Estonia being quite a new phenomenon of the inter-war and recent events , giving them an amalgamated span of 45 years in two period
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Old December 27th, 2017, 12:17 AM   #106
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Latvian and Lithuanian are east Baltic branch of the Baltic languages. As similar as Russian and Polish. They can understand each other to some extend having been exposed for a little while to each other's language. There is an eastern Latvian dialect known as Latgalian. Some consider the dialect to be a separate Baltic language. Lithuanian also have dialects such as Samogitian. Estonian is a Finnic branch of Finno-Ugric languages.
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Old December 31st, 2017, 01:05 AM   #107

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Originally Posted by greatstreetwarrior View Post
Are Estonia, Lithuania and Latvia more Germanic or are they more Nordic?
I hope this question is a joke....
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Old July 6th, 2018, 03:22 AM   #108
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Demographic processes in Estonia from Bronze Age through Iron Age to Medieval times:

Eurogenes Blog: SMBE 2018 abstracts

N3 and R1a are the two most common Y chromosome haplogroups among modern Estonians. R1a appears with Corded Ware culture but the arrival of hg N has not been determined. To this end we have extracted and studied aDNA from teeth of 18 individuals bracketing the changes in the material culture in the end of the Bronze and early Iron Age. We find N3 in Iron Age but not in Bronze Age. Due to the small sample size we cannot refute the existence of hg N in the latter. In genome-wide analyses the Bronze Age and especially Iron Age samples appear very similar to modern Estonians implying population continuity.

Christianization (13 cc AD) established a new elite of West European origin, which presumably had an impact on the genetic structure of the local population. To investigate this we extracted DNA from teeth of 35 individuals, who have been uncovered from both rural (considered local Estonian population) and town (likely of West European origin) cemeteries of Estonia.

We compared the low coverage genomes with each other and with relevant modern and ancient Estonian and other European populations. We find that there is a clear discontinuity between the elite and common people, where the former group genetically with modern German samples and the latter with modern Estonians. We do find three individuals of mixed genetic ancestry. But importantly we do not see a steady shift of either local population strata, which suggests limited contact between the elite and the common people.
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Old July 6th, 2018, 06:23 AM   #109
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Last edited by stevev; July 6th, 2018 at 06:31 AM.
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