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Old May 16th, 2017, 05:49 AM   #11

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Why did you tack it on to the end of the question? it was in the OP so i addressed it in full.
I was making a general comment on France and Morocco. Why did you over react though, why the need for the ! mark? Was it because I mentioned Morocco in a positive fashion, honestly had I not mentioned Morocco and had I only mentioned France would you have reacted the way you did. In short what I am asking you mate is did you react the way you did itt due to my comment on Morocco?
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Old May 16th, 2017, 05:50 AM   #12
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Morocco's recognition of the United States may be the first, however, the French and Dutch loaning the United States millions would be of far more importance as a sign of recognition.
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Old May 16th, 2017, 06:08 AM   #13

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Only France and the Dutch Republic, as sovereign nations*, formally recognised the American rebels before the Treaty of Paris. While Spain joined the other two powers in making war on Britain they did so as an ally of France, not of the insurgents and did not extend recognition.
After France and the Dutch, the first country to diplomatically recognise the USA was actually Great Britain.
The US "warm relations" with the pirate nation of Morocco cost the US
$80,000 in tribute (or bribes as we would call it today)--talking about grasping at straws.




*Native tribes don't count in this instance.
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Old May 16th, 2017, 06:18 AM   #14

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Originally Posted by JoanOfArc007 View Post
I was making a general comment on France and Morocco. Why did you over react though, why the need for the ! mark? Was it because I mentioned Morocco in a positive fashion, honestly had I not mentioned Morocco and had I only mentioned France would you have reacted the way you did. In short what I am asking you mate is did you react the way you did itt due to my comment on Morocco?
No because it adds nothing to the subject matter.

It only pushes a certain agenda, in your case a sort of kumbaya. Fine by me, but expect to get remarks on that by me as well.
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Old May 16th, 2017, 06:30 AM   #15

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoanOfArc007 View Post
I was making a general comment on France and Morocco. Why did you over react though, why the need for the ! mark? Was it because I mentioned Morocco in a positive fashion, honestly had I not mentioned Morocco and had I only mentioned France would you have reacted the way you did. In short what I am asking you mate is did you react the way you did itt due to my comment on Morocco?
It would have been the same reaction irregardless, you are pushing some world unity agenda and have been tacking on to the end of nearly every post you make.

For what reason does your opinion on france and morocco matter when the question asked beforehand is a historical one? why must your agenda be added to the end of every post you make? i do not understand
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Old May 16th, 2017, 06:56 AM   #16

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It is an interesting bit of historic trivia. The American legation building in Tangier, Morocco is the oldest such American building outside the U.S. and the only place designated a national historic landmark by America in a foreign country.

But it doesn't represent any goodwill from Morocco since the Barbary states just kept extorting tribute until America responded with force. The Barbary pirates did expose the weakness of the U.S and the need for a national navy.
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Old May 16th, 2017, 06:56 AM   #17

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No because it adds nothing to the subject matter.

It only pushes a certain agenda, in your case a sort of kumbaya. Fine by me, but expect to get remarks on that by me as well.
Please Dont tell me I am pushing an agenda. I am not pushing an agenda..and I do not put words into other posters mouth. I would not accuse you of pushing an agenda. Its inappropriate for you to also talk to me as you are itt...using these words like kumbaya and yawn toward me when I never mentioned your name in the OP.

Last edited by JoanOfArc007; May 16th, 2017 at 07:41 AM. Reason: typo
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Old May 16th, 2017, 06:58 AM   #18

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It would have been the same reaction irregardless, you are pushing some world unity agenda and have been tacking on to the end of nearly every post you make.

For what reason does your opinion on france and morocco matter when the question asked beforehand is a historical one? why must your agenda be added to the end of every post you make? i do not understand
That is not the case at all. I merely posted a thread and it was you whom used the ! mark against me. I am not adding an agenda to this and please I am going to ask you to not make accusations against me as I would not do so to you.
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Old May 16th, 2017, 07:00 AM   #19

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That is not the case at all. I merely posted a thread and it was you whom used the ! mark against me. I am not adding an agenda to this and please I am going to ask you to not make accusations against me as I would not do so to you.
Then why add?

"Either way I respect both France and Morocco in large part due to their longstanding relation with the US."
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Old May 16th, 2017, 07:24 AM   #20

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Then why add?

"Either way I respect both France and Morocco in large part due to their longstanding relation with the US."
Its merely a general comment... no different than the thousands of comments which might show respect for the Roman Empire, Alexander the Great, or some empire or person of history. Now I could understand if one wanted to in return provide a viewpoint on France or Morocco that I might disagree with. But what I do not understand is the exclamation mark from you and the yawn/kumbaya comment from William. I have respect for both you and William I was honestly surprised at your comment because its not like I mentioned either of you by name in my original post. What I can tell you is I made this thread with honest intentions...and that intention was to find out what country was the first country to recognize the USA.

Now with that said, I wish you and William the best and I will only be commenting on the topic of the OP from here on out itt.

There are currently two countries competing for the title of first country to recognize the United States? Not only are we trying to figure out whom first recongized the USA, but certainly what kind of allies were France and Morocco to the USA, and morally speaking were France and Morocco of the 18th century morally the same, better, or worse when compared to the US?

The US state dept suggests that it was France that first recognized the USA.

Yet Forbes.com suggests that Morocco was the first nation to recognize France.

Now what also comes along with this type of question as I talked about above is what kind of allies are France and Morocco to the USA? I see in France as that country that helped the USA to win the American revolution. We had Frenchmen serving alongside Americans in the fight against the British during Americas war of Independance.

As for Morocco..... Certainly to some of the points itt the world of the past was a violent time, you had barbary pirates, English pirates, slave owners all around the world...morally speaking the 15th-19th century was a different time. Napoleon has been accused of war crimes and he lived the late 18th-earlier 19th century right around the time period this thread discusses. So I wont write off Morocco though due to the barbary pirates...I wont write off England due to Francis Drake being a slaver.....I wont write off the US due to the US at one point practicing slavery.

And to ancient geezers point...if a foreign country was operating in US waters I would demand tribute or perhaps declare a war action against the foreign countries ship operating in my waters. Besides we are talking about the 18th century here...warefare was more common in the 18th century but certainly men would hash out there issues diplomatically....and that is what occured with Morocco and the USA.

Morocco has enjoyed a vibrant relationship with the United States since time immemorial. In 1777, Morocco was the first country in the world to formally acknowledge the United States as an independent nation. It is also crucial to note that Morocco has been a loyal and indispensable American ally during these trying political times in the Maghreb, of which Morocco is an integral part. We have been consistent supporters of the United States in its relentless campaigns to negotiate and facilitate peace during the unfortunate political events that have unfolded in the region. Last year, both Morocco and the United States engaged in strategic dialogue to address most of these issues and deliberate on solutions

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kerryad.../#e119eb54f75d

So to antocya point.... I do see goodwill from both France and Morocco. Of course to each their own.
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