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Old April 17th, 2018, 10:42 AM   #1
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Irish anti-americanism


https://www.irishcentral.com/opinion...7713-238108701

I was surprised by this. I'm referring to the time before the 2016 US elections when Obama was in office. I know the President of Ireland holds a ceremonial office but he does represent the country. What did the US ever do to Ireland? There are substantial US investments there that employ many Irish workers. Irish Americans are a substantial group in the US. Somebody please explain. Remember, this is pre-Trump.
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Old April 17th, 2018, 12:28 PM   #2

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Stevev,
Like the article pointed out, he was the best of a poor lot of candidates in the election. He was always on the left of mainstream politics in Ireland and was never shy about giving his opinion on any issue,both domestic and foreign.
Having said that, being critical of American foreign policy, does not make you anti American. While the vast majority of Irish people have great affection for the United States and it's culture, they do not necessarily approve of everything America does in it's foreign policy. I think that might be an attitude shared by many internationally.
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Old April 17th, 2018, 01:45 PM   #3
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Column: 'There should be a presidential election and Michael D shouldn't run'

Being critical of US policy is normal and expected. The US should stay out other countries' affairs or US should not retreat into isolationism. US should be more leftist and support leftist regimes even if they are not democratic or US should support democracy and human rights and free trade. The mere existence of the US has been the target of endless vilification from Europe no matter what it does or doesn't do. So now the US has become something you can vilify due in part to the this ceaseless barrage which I've heard all my life. If Obama was evil in the eyes of your President, then how about now? Your President goes well beyond the normal level anti-US rhetoric and seems likely to be re-elected.

Last edited by stevev; April 17th, 2018 at 02:05 PM.
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Old April 17th, 2018, 02:09 PM   #4

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Stevev,
To the best of my knowledge, he never called Obama evil. As far as I can remember, it was Ronald Regan that he had all the criticism for. Even then, it was not personal. It was all about Nicaragua.
As to his re-election, it all depends who will crawl out of the woodwork to oppose him.
Personally I will not be voting for him this time as he said he would only do one term, and he should keep his word.
Anyway he is a ceremonial President of a small country and a bit of criticism should run off the US like water off a duck's back.
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Old April 17th, 2018, 02:21 PM   #5

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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevev View Post
https://www.irishcentral.com/opinion...7713-238108701

I was surprised by this. I'm referring to the time before the 2016 US elections when Obama was in office. I know the President of Ireland holds a ceremonial office but he does represent the country. What did the US ever do to Ireland? There are substantial US investments there that employ many Irish workers. Irish Americans are a substantial group in the US. Somebody please explain. Remember, this is pre-Trump.
You must understand this is a spinoff of Irish Nationalism's anti-British prejudice, America shares so much of Britain's values it is hardly surprising they seek to bite the hand that feeds them.
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Old April 17th, 2018, 03:36 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SirOrmondeWinter View Post
You must understand this is a spinoff of Irish Nationalism's anti-British prejudice, America shares so much of Britain's values it is hardly surprising they seek to bite the hand that feeds them.
Perhaps. It just surprised me coming from Ireland. I have an Irish grandmother myself. There are hard core leftists everywhere who see the US as the perpetual enemy. Even during the Obama administration Higgins openly supported Hugo Chavez who was a leading member of this club. This puts him beyond the usual level of anti-American rhetoric coming from other European sources.

The real problem is that Americans are tired of it. There is a clear isolationist trend which was signaled in the 2016 election. The fact is, as a nuclear power of the first rank, the US doesn't have to be the world's policeman to be safe. If Russia invades the Ukraine and/or the Baltic states, that clearly is Europe's problem. Should it be the US's problem too as long as the Russians a have reasonable fear of nuclear retaliation?

Regarding the UK, Jeremy Corbyn remains largely unknown to the US general public. His anti-American rhetoric would have an effect in the US even if he doesn't come to power.

Last edited by stevev; April 17th, 2018 at 03:42 PM.
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Old April 17th, 2018, 07:55 PM   #7
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More right wing drivel from Sir Ormond DeWinter.
The idea that all people of a left wing political inclination are anti-Amercan is paranoid piffle. My politics are unashemedly left of centre but -apart from when the USA does silly things like the Vietnam War which they provoked by the US govt irresponsibly inducing some of their Vietnamese puppets to abrogate a peace deal in Vietnam brokered by a British Conservattive Prime Minister in 1954- I am very pro American in most things-although I think for a country with the USA's wealth to have 30 million citiizens without decent health care cover is absurd and scandalous.
No society- and that includes the USA- is perfect and beyond vaild critiicism .It always amuses me that some USA citizens are so insecure that they can't take criticism or debate American social problems without conjuring up paranoid nonsense that if you criticise the USA you must be an enemy-that kind of thinking is straight out the civil codes. of all dictatorships.
The attitude and behaviour of American Caucasian policemen towards their fellow Americans is also scandalous -go watch Caherine Bigelow's movie 'DETROIT' about how Caucasian American policemen in Detroit thuggishly violated the basic human rights of Afro-American men.
That's not leftist -just the plain old bloody truth..
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Old April 17th, 2018, 08:00 PM   #8
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Perpetual unaminity is the first precept of slavery. Jermenmy Corbyn has an undisputed right to hold his opinion s and articulate them and aso to criticise the USA when it behaves wrongly either to its own citiizens.
Americans who react negatively to legitimate dissent are no different from the North Koreans. The irony of this is that in 1776 the USA was born out of poltical dissent..
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Old April 17th, 2018, 09:16 PM   #9
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Perpetual unaminity is the first precept of slavery. Jermenmy Corbyn has an undisputed right to hold his opinion s and articulate them and aso to criticise the USA when it behaves wrongly either to its own citiizens.
Americans who react negatively to legitimate dissent are no different from the North Koreans. The irony of this is that in 1776 the USA was born out of poltical dissent
Perpetual unanimity is what I'm talking about. This is certainly not the case in the US nor should the US hold it itself above criticism from other nations. The unanimity I see is in those who make a career of being anti-American regardless of the issues.
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Old April 18th, 2018, 12:53 AM   #10

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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevev View Post
Perhaps. It just surprised me coming from Ireland. I have an Irish grandmother myself. There are hard core leftists everywhere who see the US as the perpetual enemy. Even during the Obama administration Higgins openly supported Hugo Chavez who was a leading member of this club. This puts him beyond the usual level of anti-American rhetoric coming from other European sources.

The real problem is that Americans are tired of it. There is a clear isolationist trend which was signaled in the 2016 election. The fact is, as a nuclear power of the first rank, the US doesn't have to be the world's policeman to be safe. If Russia invades the Ukraine and/or the Baltic states, that clearly is Europe's problem. Should it be the US's problem too as long as the Russians a have reasonable fear of nuclear retaliation?

Regarding the UK, Jeremy Corbyn remains largely unknown to the US general public. His anti-American rhetoric would have an effect in the US even if he doesn't come to power.
Yes and I don't blame them, Gladstone railed for years against Britain being the world's policeman and I think that's true here too, Theresa May didn't ask parliament to sanction bombing Syria because Cameron did so last time and parliament saying no gave Obama a chance to chicken out. But the truth is SOMEONE has to be.
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