JohnnyH

How would the allies have been fixed militarily/politically if, instead of one axis power actually losing and so allied forces turned against the other- as did happen, the Japanese miraculously managed to fight the allies to a standstill?

It's clear that, even before pearl Harbour, the Japanese high command believed they couldn't ever defeat the US completely, but only gain a 6-month breathing space to forge a strong empire, and possibly bargain with her/the allies.

So in this unlikely but not impossible scenario, and supposing that the A-bomb development had been years behind schedule;-

If Hitler had fallen and the allies amassed their regrouped forces against a renewed strong Japan, who had launched such devastating attacks etc on land through Burma, and kamikaze plane/torpedo-boat/mini-sub(as they had) at sea, enough to reverse the US fleet's great victories and fight the allies to a standstill...

...What would the allies have done next? A frontal all-out seaborne invasion like D-Day, considering how suicidal the japanese had been at Kohima, Imphal, Saipan, Iwo Jima and Oki Nawa?

Which would be so bloody and merciless(even japanese women and children on their homeland were gearing up for banzai attacks) that allied leaders believed would cost 1m US lives alone, let alone British, Canadian, French, Russian(?), Anzac etc

heikstheo

Japan would've become a bunch of fat lazy imperialists who would've had no incentive to develop any industry in the home islands.

Lucius

I think the fighting on Kyushu would have been so horrible that the Americans would have postponed the invasion of the rest until it had all been incinerated, flattened, re-incinerated and re-flattened before proceeding on with the land invasion. It would have taken years and years. But, it's not like Japan was going anywhere.

Dr Realism

Pragmatism would have eventually intervened. If the war in Europe had already been decided, and the war with Japan dragged on, the US-USSR alliance would have still been experiencing the same tensions that it did in real history. If the Japanese were still going strong at that point, the USSR would probably decide to let the US and Japan dook it out while the USSR recovered its strength.(Much in the way that the US let the USSR dook it out with the Germans). Seeing this strategy and realizing that Japan was no longer a threat to the US, and realizing that the War was basically only about vengeance, the US would have brokered an armistice with Japan. The US would occupy Manchuria, Korea, and the rest of Japan's Empire to prevent them from falling into the Soviet's hands. The US and Japan would probably still end up in some sort of alliance or detente in order to confront the USSR. With no A-bombs, a war with the USSR would be more likely.

gashead

no i dont think that would happen. With the states preoccupied in the pacific, the USSR would have launched their invasion of manchuria and pushed to capture all Japanese territory in the region. With this achieved, they would then sit back and, as you said, recover their strength while the US dealt with Japan. Despite the fact that the war with Japan was about vengeance, I seriously doubt the american public would have easily accepted an armistice with the Japanese.

Dr Realism

If the USSR entered the war against Japan, then the Japanese would probably surrender a lot quicker, much like they did in reality. That would be contrary to the USSR's goal of having Japan and the US slog it out. Once the Japanese finally surrendered, then your probably right about the USSR taking Manchuria, but they would probably wait until the last possible second.

Procopius

i always thought towards august the USSR did press into Manchuria and japenese territories along the border. I might be wrong but i think the U.S wanted to end it quickly so there would be no split Japan where half was communist.

JerseyPerson14

If japan had won ww2 then judo would be the most popular sport in the world. J/k

Procopius

lol....

DigitusImpudicus

IMO, there would have been little change from history. Conventional bombing would heve been just as devastating as atomics in the long run.

Actually, I've been playing out this scenario in our game Making History. Playing the US, I defeat Germany and push Japan back to its home islands. Instead of putting my money into further atomic research, I focused on building better carriers and advanced carrier aircraft, and also huge numbers of ground attack and long range bombers. Once I reclaim the Philippines and take Formosa (Taiwan), I'm able to bring large numbers of land-based bombers and carrier aircraft to bear on all of Japan. Then I just keep up the air campaign for a while, preventing any imports from reaching the Japanese islands.

In six months they are done. Even the bravest troops can't fight without food and equipment.

Meanwhile, in Europe, the Brits and other western allies and I are keeping our readiness high as long as the USSR has forces in Germany. This prevents the USSR from redeploying in force to the pacific

Chris--