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Old January 16th, 2013, 06:27 AM   #11

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There is no way that Congo would have had a population of much more than 10 million in the 1880s-1900s, let alone a death toll that high.

The original list is a bit fixated on the 20th Century, too. Poor old Mengele, how on earth does he make the list? As a doctor he killed less people that Albert Schweitzer did with his slipshod practices and squalid, filthy clinic.
What about Atilla? Genghis Khan, Subetai and Jochi? Ivan the Terrible? Sultan Abdul Hamid? There are lots of others.
I 'd like to see Cromwell in there as well, just as a bit of patriotism.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 06:39 AM   #12

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Originally Posted by h6wq9rjk View Post
no Mao, no Gengis Khan, epic fail.
Mao makes Saddam Hussein looks like a cute lovely angel
Click the image to open in full size.
Interesting chart, where did you find it?
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Old January 16th, 2013, 06:44 AM   #13

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Originally Posted by Corto Maltese View Post
1. Adolf Hitler
2. Joseph Stalin
3. Vladimir Lenin
4. Maximillen Rosbespierre
5. Idi Amin
6. ivan The Terrible
7. Pol Pot
8. Josef Mengelse
9. Heinrich Himmler
10. Thomas de Torquemada
11. Saddam Hussein
12. Adolf Eichmann
13. Kim Il Sung
14. Osama Bin Laden
15. Vidkun Quisling


Who would you people put as the 15 most evil people in history
Tell you what, instead of a superficial list of names and shouting at people, why don't you add some actual content to your post, show us that you actually know some history, and explain why these people deserve to be called the most evil people in history?

Quisling? Not even close. Eichmann and Himmler but no Heydrich?

If you just want lists of stuff, you can have my laundry list.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 07:01 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Ancientgeezer View Post
There is no way that Congo would have had a population of much more than 10 million in the 1880s-1900s, let alone a death toll that high.
I haven't the slightest conception of what Congo's population was in the 1880s, so I don't know how much faith to put in the estimate, but I;m curious where your in depth knowledge of Congolese demography is drawn from?
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Old January 16th, 2013, 07:09 AM   #15

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Originally Posted by Ancientgeezer View Post
There is no way that Congo would have had a population of much more than 10 million in the 1880s-1900s, let alone a death toll that high.

The original list is a bit fixated on the 20th Century, too. Poor old Mengele, how on earth does he make the list? As a doctor he killed less people that Albert Schweitzer did with his slipshod practices and squalid, filthy clinic.
What about Atilla? Genghis Khan, Subetai and Jochi? Ivan the Terrible? Sultan Abdul Hamid? There are lots of others.
I 'd like to see Cromwell in there as well, just as a bit of patriotism.
Dr. Joseph Mengele and Dr.Albert Schweitzer surely cannot compared on the basis of the deaths resulting because of them.
Mengele was the essentially evil person using his craft of surgery and knowledge of medicine to inflict pain and death on captive humans , many of them children , how is he less harmful than Dr. Schweitzer, whose intentions were certainly noble ? Do you have any evidence reg. the no.of deaths resulting from Dr. Schweitzer's " slipshod practices and filthy clinic " ?
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Old January 16th, 2013, 09:00 AM   #16

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I see no Tamerlane in this thread. It is hypothesized that he killed more than 15 million people during his conquests.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 09:37 AM   #17

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Originally Posted by Kaficek View Post
I haven't the slightest conception of what Congo's population was in the 1880s, so I don't know how much faith to put in the estimate, but I;m curious where your in depth knowledge of Congolese demography is drawn from?
Too lazy to do your own research?
Every European explorer from Mungo Park, through Stanley to George Selous noted how empty of people Southern and Central Africa was. There were a number of reasons for this. In East Africa especially, the lands were de-populated by Arab slavery, in Central Africa this was compounded by disease, a very high child mortality rate and in general, African agricultural techniques did not allow for any form of food surplus which limited population growth. Population explosions did not occur much before the 1920s when European agricultural practices and medicine began to make their mark.
For example, the country with reasonably accurate scientific censuses before the 1930s was South Africa. In 1880 the population there 2.4 million of which 33% were White, in 1904 it was 5.1 million of which 21.6% were White, in 1960 that became 16 million of which 19% were White. In other words the Native population had increased tenfold in sixty years. Similarly the population of British East Africa shows similar growth from under a million estimated native people in 1890 to 8.1 million in 1960.
The claims of Congo deaths under Leopold’s Congo Free State are wild estimates that were chucked around during the Congo Propaganda War of the 1900s and vary between 2 million and 15 million (according to the New York Times) and accounted for 50% of the Congo’s population. As the population of the ENTIRE CONTINENT was estimated between 90 and 133 millions in 1900*, to have had a population of 30 million the Congo would have to have accounted for between 33% and 23% of the continent’s population, have six times the population of the intensively farmed and well developed South Africa and enjoy the highest population density of the Continent. (The population of the USA was just 76 million at the time). Based on the populations of other countries in Africa, a head count of 5 to 6 million in 1900 would be realistic and possibly inflated. The 1924 census suggested a population of 8 million in that year.
So any claims of the death toll from Belgian excesses ( and they did happen) should confine the numbers to—lots or quite a few and not claim figures pulled out of the air.



*African Studies Review 49.1 (2006) 179-181

Roger Casement's Congo Report and 1903 Diary


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Old January 16th, 2013, 09:43 AM   #18

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Originally Posted by rvsakhadeo View Post
Dr. Joseph Mengele and Dr.Albert Schweitzer surely cannot compared on the basis of the deaths resulting because of them.
Mengele was the essentially evil person using his craft of surgery and knowledge of medicine to inflict pain and death on captive humans , many of them children , how is he less harmful than Dr. Schweitzer, whose intentions were certainly noble ? Do you have any evidence reg. the no.of deaths resulting from Dr. Schweitzer's " slipshod practices and filthy clinic " ?
I was winding up the OP. However, do YOU know how many people Mengele Killed or how many people he experimented on? Tens? Thousands? Five? Whatever his (unproven) track record, by the nature of his job he does not deserve to be on the list; there are worse people around today.
As far as Dear Dr Schweitzer is concerned read this:-

Point of Departure - James Cameron - Google Books
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Old January 16th, 2013, 10:01 AM   #19

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The most evil person in history is probably some psycho who was too evil and twisted even to make it up the ladder to being a leader.

There are rumours that Beria of the Soviet Union was pretty evil.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 11:06 PM   #20

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1.Henry VIII
2.Bloody Mary
3.Oliver Cromwell
4.Churchill
5.Torquemada
6.Fernando Alvarez de Toledo,Duke of Alba
7.Francisco Franco
8.Charles IX
9.Napoleon
10.Hitler
11.Truman
12.Bocassa
13.Suharto
14.Gorbachov
15.Yeltsin
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