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Old September 19th, 2006, 05:22 AM   #1

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Poitiers in the Hundred Years War


September 19, 1356

In a landmark battle of the Hundred Years' War, English Prince Edward defeats the French at Poitiers.

What happened in this battle? Why was it such a landmark in the Hundred Years War?
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Old September 19th, 2006, 06:07 AM   #2

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I think the battle marked the last major victory for the English...during the later part of Edward III's reign, he began to lose a lot of land he had once conquered. In terms of the significance of the actual battle being fought I'm not sure on those details.
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Old September 20th, 2006, 04:31 AM   #3

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comet
I think the battle marked the last major victory for the English...during the later part of Edward III's reign, he began to lose a lot of land he had once conquered. In terms of the significance of the actual battle being fought I'm not sure on those details.
Last? So what about Agincourt (1415)??
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Old September 20th, 2006, 03:59 PM   #4

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Originally Posted by kingtaker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Comet
I think the battle marked the last major victory for the English...during the later part of Edward III's reign, he began to lose a lot of land he had once conquered. In terms of the significance of the actual battle being fought I'm not sure on those details.
Last? So what about Agincourt (1415)??
I probably should have phrased my answer better. It is the last battle before hell begins to break loose in England. Until Henry V, England lost a majority of their French territories. By the way, I'm glad someone brought up Agincourt...in my study of the early Lancastrian dynasty and the Lollards, I have noticed that Henry was going to strip the Church of its wealth and land, but Archbishop Chichele provides Henry with a better option...attack France and claim the French throne. If this is true, I'm not so sure Agincourt comes about....what do you think kingtaker?
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Old September 20th, 2006, 10:18 PM   #5

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I vaguely remember that the Archbishop of Canterbury sided with the Bishop of Ely over a tax bill proposed by the late Henry IV that if passed would confiscate church property, and his son and successor, Henry V, aimed to pass it also.

Contemplating the urgent issue of Church reform, they're intent on keeping their possessions close by. A distraction is required and the Archbishop has one ready - a claim for lands in France that King Henry is duty bound to enforce. Through the likelihood of war, the Church can palm Henry off with a large donation and remain intact.

But I haven't read about Henry's treatment of the church whilst launching chevaucheés across France, so I'm unsure what exactly his personal views of the church were per se. I always thought Henry was a pious man, despite being capable of the casual brutality of those times.

I think that it was only a natural progression and matter of time before Henry V, a provenly-capable and seasoned warrior(against the Percy family at the battle os Shrewsbury in 1403 & Bramham Moor in 1408), invaded France to press his claims, ever since King John lost control there, and Henry's great grandfather, Edward III(and his son the Black Prince) had struggled to hold regained lands(latter reign), as you said.
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Old April 9th, 2011, 10:32 AM   #6

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battle of Poitiers 1356


Can I revive this thread?

From what I've read, the battle of Poitiers was handled by a 16 year old Prince with a handful of archers with long bows against the whole heavy chivalry of the French kingdom. The English guys were quick and mobile. The French were heavily burdened on horses in mud up to their knees. The French were still fighting in their medieval ways. The English had the modern weapons and the mobility.

It was a grand defeat for the French kingdom. And yes, Edward III had good reasons to claim the French crown. The tragedy is that this claim went on for a whole century.
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Old April 9th, 2011, 11:28 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by frankieduberry View Post
The English guys were quick and mobile. The French were heavily burdened on horses in mud up to their knees. The French were still fighting in their medieval ways. The English had the modern weapons and the mobility.
Sounds like this fellow agrees with you.

'The ability to adapt can be a key to military success. The English had learned from their defeats at the hands of the dismounted Scots at Stirling Bridge and Bannockburn as well as from reports of similar incidents elsewhere in Europe, and had been deploying their men-at-arms on foot to great effect since then. The French, using the centuries-old mounted tactics, had been soundly defeated by dismounted Flemings (at Courtrai in 1302) and by dismounted English forces at Morlaix, Crécy, and other smaller engagements. By the Battle of Saintes in 1351, however, the French began employing similar tactics, though with less success than the English aggressors.

Though the French had begun to adapt to tactics similar to those used by the English, the English continued to adapt as well, simply shifting tactics when they found a well-prepared enemy. It should be noted that this victory cannot be placed solely at the feet of some perceived English brilliance, despite what some have written. The combination of tactics, an experienced army, favorable lay of the land, lack of cohesion in the French leadership, the retreat of the Duke of Orléans' forces, and the effect of Jean de Grailly's small band of cavalry proved to be too much for the larger French army.'


I'm always impressed by the abilities of unsung heroes - in this case of the 20,000 man French army - who managed to muster and then find provisions for so many people, given the conditions of those times, such as poor roads, spotty communications, farmers reluctant to part with food and fodder, etc.,. Easy enough to focus on princes and knights, but let's give a cheer for the staff officers too - what there were of them.
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Old April 10th, 2011, 06:24 AM   #8

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As at Crecy, Poitiers's victory is the result of a better tactic to another: choose the right battlefield, wait behind ditches and hedges; there's the skill of archers too, their mobility and responsiveness give the assurance of success for the English.
Instead, in the French side, there is no real tactics, everyone wants to cover himself with glory. The constable and the marshals did not manage to agree, and everyone will do his idea!
Ten years after Crecy, the French have not learned the lesson. This situation will change when the French adopt other tactics, under Charles V for example, or when the bow shall be supplanted by the artillery (at the end of the war).
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Old April 10th, 2011, 06:46 AM   #9

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battle of Poitiers 1356


Ringo! Nice to see you here
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Old April 10th, 2011, 06:49 AM   #10

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Ringo! Nice to see you here
Hello Frankie
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