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Medieval and Byzantine History Medieval and Byzantine History Forum - Period of History between classical antiquity and modern times, roughly the 5th through 16th Centuries


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Old January 2nd, 2018, 12:48 PM   #1

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Plate armour and heraldry


When the plate armour was developed during the Late Medieval Era how did nobles show their coat of arms on their armour? Because iirc they didn't use surcoté and tabards with plate armours (hence the name white armour) and they were already in decline in 15th century.
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Old January 2nd, 2018, 01:01 PM   #2

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On shields, helmets and even armour, also lance pinnons. Wiki mentions shields.
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Old January 2nd, 2018, 03:30 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rex Hiemis View Post
When the plate armour was developed during the Late Medieval Era how did nobles show their coat of arms on their armour? Because iirc they didn't use surcoté and tabards with plate armours (hence the name white armour) and they were already in decline in 15th century.
This image of King Arthur from the Nine Worthies tapestry circa 1385 shows him wearing a surcoat with his coat of arms over plate armor.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_A..._tapestry2.jpg

This shows many of the Nine Worthies wearing tabards over their plate armor.

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The Nine Worthies and the Nine Worthy Women detail of Julius Caesar Joshua King David Judas Maccabeus King Arthur Charlemagne Godfrey de Bouillon and Delphine reproduction by Giacomo Jaquerio - Artchive.com


Here is a image of King john Baliol of Scotland wearing a tabard with his arms over plate armor.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_B...hn_Balliol.jpg

Here are King Edward III and his son Edward the Black Prince in a miniature from 1390.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward...ince_14thc.jpg

And Edward III at the Battle of Crecy.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward...Cr%C3%A9cy.jpg

The Coronation of King Charles VI of France, with two nobles wearing tabards over their plate armor.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charle...-Aim%C3%A9.jpg

In this picture King Charles VI and some of his men wear tabards over their plate armor.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charle...Charles_VI.jpg

This drawing of the great seal of Henry VII shows him on hte obverse wearing a tabard over plate armor.

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DECORATIVE Great seal of Henry VII antique print 1845

Thus we see that many medieval persons believed that kings and knights could wear surcoats or tabards over plate armor.
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Old January 2nd, 2018, 03:46 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rex Hiemis View Post
When the plate armour was developed during the Late Medieval Era how did nobles show their coat of arms on their armour? Because iirc they didn't use surcoté and tabards with plate armours (hence the name white armour) and they were already in decline in 15th century.
Medieval plate harness had three periods: the early period which is called 'International style' in which surcoats were warn over the plate armor (roughly the second half of the 14th century); the 'al white style' in which no coat armure was worn (roughly the first half the 15th century) and then 'Gothic style' worn (roughly the second half of the 15th century, though complete Milinese Gothic armor was already being used in Italy in 1430s) Gothic was worn with tabards.

Coats of arms are a popular term, the correct heraldry term is 'armorial bearings'. After the Middle Ages the Maximillian style of armor was worn much heavier than Medieval armor of 40-50 lbs. it was 80-90 lbs.
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Old January 3rd, 2018, 12:29 AM   #5

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We could add that the horse aided to show some heraldry symbols of a Knight / Lord.

Take a look at this representation full of notes:

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It was difficult to think that this guy was a Knight of the Dukedom of Milan ...
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