Historum - History Forums  

Go Back   Historum - History Forums > World History Forum > Medieval and Byzantine History
Register Forums Blogs Social Groups Mark Forums Read

Medieval and Byzantine History Medieval and Byzantine History Forum - Period of History between classical antiquity and modern times, roughly the 5th through 16th Centuries


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old February 24th, 2018, 07:50 PM   #1

VHS's Avatar
VHS
Vague Historical Studies
 
Joined: Dec 2015
From: Orion Arm
Posts: 3,601
Blog Entries: 1
The truth about the so-called "Dark Age"


Until the Renaissance, it was said that European civilizations never reached the level of the Romans in the Medieval period.
Interestingly enough, while the Mongols brought massive destruction to existing infrastructures, they also brought in technologies that changed Europe forever.
How did the idea of the "Dark Age" form?
What were the major European medieval achievements?
VHS is offline  
Remove Ads
Old February 24th, 2018, 08:27 PM   #2
Historian
 
Joined: Jan 2013
From: Anywhere
Posts: 1,170

Quote:
Originally Posted by VHS View Post
Until the Renaissance, it was said that European civilizations never reached the level of the Romans in the Medieval period.
Interestingly enough, while the Mongols brought massive destruction to existing infrastructures, they also brought in technologies that changed Europe forever.
How did the idea of the "Dark Age" form?
What were the major European medieval achievements?
Its probably due too the Viking age and Slavic Migrations to the south.

But there were early achievements like the Carolingian Renaissance, the Ottonian Renaissance, the Macedonian Renaissance. Which was a short lived golden age in Europe.

Sent from my LG-H872 using Tapatalk
Azarius Balios is offline  
Old February 24th, 2018, 09:37 PM   #3

Belgarion's Avatar
Cynical Optimist
 
Joined: Jul 2011
From: Australia
Posts: 6,099

The term 'Dark Ages' is now considered a misomer. Europe did not suddenly fall into centuries of barbarism after the fall of the western Roman Empire, but the lack of written records after the fall of Rome led to the use of the term.
Belgarion is offline  
Old February 24th, 2018, 09:38 PM   #4

alexfritz's Avatar
Academician
 
Joined: Feb 2018
From: EU-Germany
Posts: 71

as i understand it (dark) has to do with the literacy, sciences and access to knowledge which was limited in the middle ages and largely restricted to and regulated by the clergy; the high middle ages however saw a great interaction with the islamic world and new advancements were made with translating works from muslim scholars as well as re-translating the classical texts, plus hindu-arabic numerals introduced; yet pre-printing press made access limited/exclusive;
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...%80%931500.png
the late middle ages is defined by the great plague 'black death' that might factor into the 'dark' notion;
alexfritz is offline  
Old February 24th, 2018, 09:55 PM   #5

The Keen Edge's Avatar
Lecturer
 
Joined: Jan 2016
From: United States, MO
Posts: 477

Quote:
Originally Posted by VHS View Post
Until the Renaissance, it was said that European civilizations never reached the level of the Romans in the Medieval period.
Interestingly enough, while the Mongols brought massive destruction to existing infrastructures, they also brought in technologies that changed Europe forever.
How did the idea of the "Dark Age" form?
What were the major European medieval achievements?
I am fairly sure that the term Dark Ages was created by Petrarch who was fond of all things roman and wanted the influence of greek and roman culture to return.
The Keen Edge is offline  
Old February 25th, 2018, 01:25 AM   #6

sparky's Avatar
Historian
 
Joined: Jan 2017
From: Sydney
Posts: 2,078
Blog Entries: 1

.
The "Dark Ages " was a misnomer coming from poncing Italians with a severe case of Roman worship amounting to mental constipation
they considered anything North of the Alps as Barbaric

the natural philosophy , architecture , music and technology was at least equal and often superior to the Romans
sparky is offline  
Old February 25th, 2018, 04:35 AM   #7
Historian
 
Joined: Jan 2013
From: Anywhere
Posts: 1,170

Quote:
Originally Posted by Belgarion View Post
The term 'Dark Ages' is now considered a misomer. Europe did not suddenly fall into centuries of barbarism after the fall of the western Roman Empire, but the lack of written records after the fall of Rome led to the use of the term.
There were written records coming from the ERE. As it was pointed out on several threads and posts that Kirialax and ANAX has pointed out. But only for those that had survived or that no one has paid attention to it. Sure the ERE was surrounded on all sides. But it didn't stop them from writing (like the poem Digenes Akrites and other historical accounts.)

However! I believed that there were records coming from the emirate of Cordoba and
Azarius Balios is offline  
Old February 25th, 2018, 06:57 AM   #8

Asherman's Avatar
Moderator
 
Joined: May 2013
From: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 3,011
Blog Entries: 34
Disrespect and provocative statement


Quote:
Originally Posted by sparky View Post
.
The "Dark Ages " was a misnomer coming from poncing Italians with a severe case of Roman worship amounting to mental constipation
they considered anything North of the Alps as Barbaric
Warning:

It was neither necessary, nor appropriate to belittle Italians with this provocative phrase. Do not do this again.
Asherman is online now  
Old February 25th, 2018, 11:44 AM   #9
Historian
 
Joined: Jun 2017
From: Connecticut
Posts: 1,782

A more appropriate way to view the Dark ages would be under the guise of mass decentralization that prevented individual entities from wielding the resources to properly invest in things like technology and infrastructure like the centralized classical states had been able to (Athens took a bunch of other greek city states money and went wild with it). As political entities started to centralize again and more resources fell into the hands of less rulers with larger collections of people, Europe began to become more advanced as there was no longer an incentive to invest in only war and religion.

One of the greatest misconceptions in history is that because of an art Renaissance in Italy that the "dark ages" were suddenly allowed to end. I feel that many have this view of history.

Gutenburg and the ability of people to print information probably had a large impact though, more so than any other invention prior to industrialization. Maritime technology also made the colonization of the new world possible?
Emperor of Wurttemburg 43 is offline  
Old February 25th, 2018, 12:31 PM   #10
Historian
 
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,568

In my view the term "dark age" simply means "unknown". (The same concept is used in Astronomy - "dark matter" and "dark energy" simply means matter and energy, which is believed must be there, but the nature of them is unknown). This arises from the fact that there was virtually nothing written down at the time, in northern Europe, therefore it was very hard to know what happened then.

Petrarch did not use the term "dark age", what he did say was "Amidst the errors there shone forth men of genius; no less keen were their eyes, although they were surrounded by darkness and dense gloom." [my emphasis]. He was talking about all the centuries (talking exclusively about Europe of course) after the fall of the Roman Empire up to his own time in the 14th century.

This graph shows that how few written documents were produced, outside of the Byzantine empire, in the 6th to 8th centuries.
Click the image to open in full size.
Similarly, there was very little produced in terms of technology in those centuries.
fascinating is online now  
Reply

  Historum > World History Forum > Medieval and Byzantine History

Tags
dark age, socalled, truth



Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What is Your Opinion About the United States Being Called "America"? Henrique Aguiar American History 289 May 6th, 2018 02:24 AM
Why France called her african colonists "pieds-noires"? Romanianboy2013 Middle Eastern and African History 2 August 10th, 2014 12:49 AM
Why is it called the "Dark Ages" ? Mohammed the Persian Medieval and Byzantine History 26 July 14th, 2011 03:15 PM

Copyright © 2006-2013 Historum. All rights reserved.