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Old December 7th, 2012, 11:25 PM   #1

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when was Italy named ?


reading through something yesterday , which was talking about the Kingdom of Italy being established in 1861 , it did not really make it clear whether this was the first time the name Italy was used for the new kingdom , or whether the name was already in use ?

just happened to notice for the first time that the name ITAL-Y , includes the letters of the language ie:- LATI-n , right to left , and in the name left to right, is there any significance in this ?.. ie could either the name of the country or the language have been named by incomers who wrote in the opposite direction , to those already there , if you see what i mean .

Just curious !
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Old December 8th, 2012, 12:57 AM   #2

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I know that when Napoleon took over around the turn of the 19th century, he renamed the former Austrian controlled "Cisapline Republic" the Republic of Italy, which later became the Kingdom of Italy. I don't know if the word was used prior to that though.
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Old December 8th, 2012, 01:15 AM   #3

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There is more than one hypothesis about the origin of the name "Italia" [real Italian name for English "Italy"].

A good suggestion is that the name came from the Greek definition of the inhabitants of modern Calabria, they called them "Italoi".

As for the usage of the name "Italia" it was used first time in VI century BCE and it made reference just to modern Calabria [a part of South Italy].

It was the historian Antioco from Siracusa to use the term Italia to indicate a good part of South Italy [it was V century BCE].

If we think to the modern extension of the country, it was Caesar to add Northern Italy to "Italia" [August added also Istria to the province].
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Old December 8th, 2012, 01:21 AM   #4

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlpinLuke View Post
There is more than one hypothesis about the origin of the name "Italia" [real Italian name for English "Italy"].

A good suggestion is that the name came from the Greek definition of the inhabitants of modern Calabria, they called them "Italoi".

As for the usage of the name "Italia" it was used first time in VI century BCE and it made reference just to modern Calabria [a part of South Italy].

It was the historian Antioco from Siracusa to use the term Italia to indicate a good part of South Italy [it was V century BCE].

If we think to the modern extension of the country, it was Caesar to add Northern Italy to "Italia" [August added also Istria to the province].
any comment on the ITAL and LATI parts of that name Alpin , or do you think thats just a coincidence ,
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Old December 8th, 2012, 01:52 AM   #5

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We can find references to Italy in quite the modern geographical sense in many roman authors, for example pliny the elder in naturalis historia lamented how latifondi ruined the agricolture of Italy
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Old December 8th, 2012, 02:08 AM   #6

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlpinLuke View Post
There is more than one hypothesis about the origin of the name "Italia" [real Italian name for English "Italy"].

A good suggestion is that the name came from the Greek definition of the inhabitants of modern Calabria, they called them "Italoi".

As for the usage of the name "Italia" it was used first time in VI century BCE and it made reference just to modern Calabria [a part of South Italy].

It was the historian Antioco from Siracusa to use the term Italia to indicate a good part of South Italy [it was V century BCE].

If we think to the modern extension of the country, it was Caesar to add Northern Italy to "Italia" [August added also Istria to the province].
So the geographic term of Italia is quite old. But when did people consider themselves Italiani? Certainly not in Roman times. And what was the basis for considering oneself Italian? The language? Did the great poets of the Trecento consider themselves Italiani, or was that a later development, maybe in response to the rise of France? Or was it even a much later development during romantic nationalism in the 19th century?
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Old December 8th, 2012, 02:10 AM   #7

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Quote:
any comment on the ITAL and LATI parts of that name Alpin , or do you think thats just a coincidence ,
It's a coincidence. Latin was the language of a specific tribe, the Latini, who settled in the area around Rome that came to be known as Latium. The name Italia was originally associated with Southern Italy and came to be used for the whole peninsula, in which a variety of languages were spoken.
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Old December 8th, 2012, 02:17 AM   #8

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We can find references to Italy in quite the modern geographical sense in many roman authors, for example pliny the elder in naturalis historia lamented how latifondi ruined the agricolture of Italy
So you are telling me that at the time of pliny the name was used Lati-fondi , that way round, rather that Ital-fondi , that way round
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Old December 8th, 2012, 02:43 AM   #9

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'latifundia' were literally 'broad' (latus) 'estates': the word has no connection with Italia or Latium/Latinus
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Old December 8th, 2012, 04:13 AM   #10

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Originally Posted by Grimald View Post
So the geographic term of Italia is quite old. But when did people consider themselves Italiani? Certainly not in Roman times.
Italy wasn't considered a province. I would say that in early imperial times already italians in general and romans (from the city) were seen as a single thing


Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimald View Post
And what was the basis for considering oneself Italian? The language? Did the great poets of the Trecento consider themselves Italiani, or was that a later development, maybe in response to the rise of France? Or was it even a much later development during romantic nationalism in the 19th century?
Petrarca wrote a poem regarding italy and how the constant fights between the various italian states were damaging and pointless. Dante too lamented the state of the peninsula so yes, the concept of italy was already there in late middleages, though it was mainly something feeled by the intellectual elites.
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