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Old November 6th, 2016, 06:18 PM   #21

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I happen to disagree in a sense with both sides of this divide or issue (assuming of course there are only two sides). From a historical perspective it is undeniable that people of the LGBTQ (I'm personally getting fed up with the ever expanding acronym) group have been mistreated in some cases severely even in very recent history (forget about the current issues of bathrooms and marriage equality, we're talking about severe persecution, death, whole lives and careers ruined, as examples see the Lavender Scare in the United States during McCarthysm, homosexuals in concentration camps in Nazi Germany, and multiple laws criminalizing gay men and women, see Alan Turing and Oscar Wilde). So I disagree with the view that all or most of the members of the LGBT are mentally ill people who need to be either locked away or be kept silent or something in that manner.
On the other hand, I feel some members of this 'community' (assuming it is such a thing) are pushing certain things or issues to ridiculous degrees (they are not alone, see some third wave feminists and people who see race issues literally everywhere).
Finally I'd like to comment that, since these issues have popped up a lot lately in the media and also here in the website, that realities are relative and even in the western world one can hardly make any meaningful sweeping generalizations regarding the status of members of western society, by this I mean one member of the LGBTQ community could be living a very carefree life in New York City in an extremely liberal and accepting atmosphere and encounter very little hardship while pressing for ever more reforms some of which in all honesty have gotten almost ridiculous (especially true in certain areas of academia that always seem to be at the forefront of lunacy). But on the other hand there's a young teenager somewhere in some rural redneck town in the Midwest getting harassed, told their going to fry in hell and worse, and even bullied and assaulted because they identify as LGBTQ (assuming them even being 'out' is even an option), which hardly seems fair to me, for those people we definitely need rights to be enforced. Finally, regarding trans-gendered individuals, I have it on good authority that they suffer the worst discrimination of all, and have the highest statistical chance of being murdered of the general population, even before discussing any other issues and 'rights' everyone's , including theirs, safety has to be secured.
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Old November 6th, 2016, 06:34 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Belgarion View Post
If a child, from a very young age, began to 'identify', with blind people to the extent that they began to run around with their eyes shut, later progressing to wearing a blindfold all the time and by their teens decided they wanted their eyes removed so they could be truly blind permanently, no one would argue this child is in the grip of a mental illness. Why is wanting your genitals removed any different?
There are people who feel one of their limbs is alien, and insist on amputation. Another might have frightening tics and scream obscenities. Another might have sexual interest in dead humans. All are mentally defective, nobody demand we accept their behavior as normal or no crazy. If their lobby groups pressure various psychiatric associations they can all the above declared no longer deviant or defective behavior, but any sane person who isn't jumping through hoops to virtue signal how accepting and enlightened they are knows that these people are loons. They shouldn't be oppressed but by not applauding and accepting their psychological eccentricities.
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Old November 6th, 2016, 07:12 PM   #23
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Does LQBTQ+phobia come from effects as a result of normalizing/popularizing LQBTQ+ or does it come from the mere existence of members of the community in public?

A rally happened in Toronto not too long ago over a proposed bill - you must address transgenders by the pronoun they identify with, and this is being considered an attack on freedom of speech. So what I want to know is - why wouldn't you address someone by their gender? Is it because you don't recognize their new gender? Is it to stick to this anti-free speech bill or similar effects that come as a result of normalizing LGBTQ+?
The operating emotion here is not of phobia, but of disgust and animosity; and it has came into being due to political assertiveness of LGBTQ+ movement.

LGBTQ+ is a political identity movement and most people have enough brain cells between them to view it as such. Its main aim is to harvest SJW culture of west to gain an exalted status for themselves and destroy conservative culture. The Toronto rally you are referring to is an example of trying to wrest special privileges for themselves not available to a lay person. This is similar to case in USA in which a bakery was sued for not baking a cake for homosexual wedding. Suppose if I visit USA and want to get a cake baked and the baked refuses me for any reason (say because I am not a Christian), there is nothing I could do about it except visiting another baker. This here is an example of special privileged.

Thus it is natural for people to mobilize against LGBTQ+++++ ,even if they do not care what people do inside their bedroom. It is a war being fought using weapons of social control.


And let's be honest here. Transgenderism is a clear cut case of a mental disorder. If I believe that I am Red Dragon, I would be diagnosed with delusional disorder and treated for that disorder. Doctors would not try to graft bionic wings into my back so that I could feel more like a dragon. A man believing that he is woman or vice versa is not much different from it. I am sure that LGBTQ+ and SJW warriors would bully APA to declassify Trasngenderism as a mental disorder, if they have not done it already, like they were forced for homosexuality (for which no proof, either for or against, exist. Declassifying it as a disorder was a value judgement, not something based on empirical facts), but that would not change what is obvious to every sane person.

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Old November 6th, 2016, 07:45 PM   #24

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A rally happened in Toronto not too long ago over a proposed bill - you must address transgenders by the pronoun they identify with, and this is being considered an attack on freedom of speech. So what I want to know is - why wouldn't you address someone by their gender? Is it because you don't recognize their new gender? Is it to stick to this anti-free speech bill or similar effects that come as a result of normalizing LGBTQ+?
It's hardly 'phobic' (i.e. medically a bit nuts) to not want people to regulate what you call them. That seems to be the main gripe. It's not that people are irrationally afraid of someone 'identifying' as whatever they want. It's not that people want to stop them. It's that they'd rather not have their advocates in high places start micro-managing our use (and abuse) of the English language.

And speaking plainly, a lot of new genders people come out with have absolutely no basis in science. Why on earth should we have to kow-tow to someone who feels they're demi-boy, stargender, or a lich lord? They can 'identify' as what they want; why should we all be compelled to agree?

Quote:
And for those of you who think transgender people are mentally ill: firstly, transgender identity does not appear as a classified disorder in the DSM-5
'Transgender identity' isn't a thing. People who are trans are transitioning from one sex to the next, or would like to. They don't 'identify' as trans. Trans is the journey, not the destination. It's also filed quite neatly under body dysmorphia, so yes it absolutely is a disorder. Gender re-assignment surgery is an extreme treatment. Not that there's anything wrong with it being a disorder. Few people say that like it's a bad thing. We're just uncomfortable with activist edgelords appropriating trans struggles for their virtue-signalling.

Last edited by Domnall Ballach; November 6th, 2016 at 07:49 PM.
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Old November 6th, 2016, 07:58 PM   #25

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https://www.acpeds.org/the-college-s...harms-children

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5.*According to the DSM-V, as many as 98% of gender confused boys and 88% of gender confused girls eventually accept their biological sex after naturally passing through puberty.

8.*Conditioning children into believing that a lifetime of chemical and surgical impersonation of the opposite sex is normal and healthful is child abuse.
This:
https://ageofshitlords.com/sorry-tum...y-two-genders/

Disproves this:
?The idea of two sexes is simplistic. Biologists now think there is a wider spectrum than that.? ? Pharyngula

WHO | Gender and Genetics

I doubt that the WHO states that they are 1001 genders. Different cultures have different qualities, traits, and identifiers for a third gender, but it is a mix of male and female with a variety of different percentages. There are 6 sexes, but the 4 are a variation of the male and female sex.

About the professor from Toronto, he was interviewed by the Ontario based talk show called the Agenda and one of his opponent named Nicholas Matte, a transgender studies professor at the University of Waterloo, states that biological sex(not gender) doesn't exist. Hypocritical for a guy who wants to protect gender expression. Denial of gender is wrong, but the denial of biological sex is correct?! Anyways I have nothing to fear from a professor who never gave his students their essays back even when the semester is over, yet gets mad when students don't hand in their essay on time! It's of no surprise that some people heavily involved in politics are one of the laziest. Hope my online admirer avoids taking a class with him(she's majoring in Biology)

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Old November 6th, 2016, 08:19 PM   #26
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"I am a human male but I feel that I am a __________. I've seen many doctors and psychiatrists over the years, gone through many medications and treatments that didn't work before finally coming to terms that I was not a human male, I was really a __________. Thankfully I found a progressive group of medical professions to help in my transition surgeries and treatments, I feel a bit less like killing myself lately. It feels good to finally identify as a __________."

For the blank, if it's "cat," the person is crazy. If it's "lizard," the person is crazy. If it's "baby," the person is crazy. If it's the opposite sex, then they're sane and I'm the one with the privilege.
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Old November 6th, 2016, 08:25 PM   #27
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However, if a girl still has a penis and simply identifies as a girl: I cannot in good conscious address them with any pronoun other than what they actually are.
.
A shemale?
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Old November 6th, 2016, 09:42 PM   #28

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Look just treat anybody the way they treat you and call em what they want to be called, if you don't like it ,don't have anything to do with them simples

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Old November 6th, 2016, 09:44 PM   #29

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Gender dysphoria - NHS Choices

Gender Dysphoria: What It Is and How It's Treated

it's a treatable condition, and to say it's not a mental illness or shouldn't be treated is not only cruel but idiotic!
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Old November 6th, 2016, 09:47 PM   #30

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Originally Posted by aggienation View Post
"I am a human male but I feel that I am a __________. I've seen many doctors and psychiatrists over the years, gone through many medications and treatments that didn't work before finally coming to terms that I was not a human male, I was really a __________. Thankfully I found a progressive group of medical professions to help in my transition surgeries and treatments, I feel a bit less like killing myself lately. It feels good to finally identify as a __________."

For the blank, if it's "cat," the person is crazy. If it's "lizard," the person is crazy. If it's "baby," the person is crazy. If it's the opposite sex, then they're sane and I'm the one with the privilege.
It depends. it's pretty proven that the human brain is very complex and malleable. And also issues can happen in vitro as embryos. I've never heard of people having cat brains or neurology, but that's cool...
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