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Old September 22nd, 2017, 07:55 PM   #51
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Well, this did sound a bit accusatory: "Well it is good (a minimum) that it is not prohibited for an ethnic minority person to run for office."
i wrote that to this.
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Btw, our President is an ethnic German Protestant. UDMR has been in the opposition for only 6 years (without supporting the Government). Minorities don't get symbolic rights in Romania. They get rights.
i had no special accusationary intent with it, just i got that impression you subscribe these two phenomenas you mentioned to the particular minority rights existing in Romania.
My answer, it is a very enlightened and respectable thing that an ethnic minority person could win that much popular vote and therefore become president, thumbs up to the Romanian society, but the fact he was able to run for office is not a special minority right, but a minimum citizenship right. Same with UDMR having that much parliamentary representation is not due to the otherwise existing minority rights. They have that 6+% voter base (that many Romanian citizen voters), thats why they have that big parliamentary faction and the ability to be coalition partner due to it.


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Btw, there's one thing to be able to run for office and another to win the most important position. I don't see an ethnic minority doing that in Hungary any time soon.
That is true. Well the late Hungarian president Mádl Ferenc was also an ethnic German, though in Hungary it is elected by parliament (we only elect directly the mps, mayors and town council members, also those registering, can vote to ethnic minority self government members too). If you would ask me in the 90s and early 2000s i would say why not, i could imagine an ethnic minority top politician could be successfull in Hungary too. but now i'm not sure myself. But it is not due to rights, rather the political climate...

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I was there a few times. Always enjoyed it. The people were nice, as was the scenery. However, some parts look awful (obviously, not the tourist attractions).

Did people complain about discrimination?
i remember a few rough parts socialist block buildings shocked me when we accidently stopped at Barót/Baraolt, otherwise nothing dramatic for my taste. I didn't ask about discrimination or politics in general (i find it little impolite to bring that up when i'm a visitor). I saw a few little things that i found odd and probably locals find provocative or "offensive"/"invasive" (or maybe they are already used to it) but i think those do not strictly belong to discrimination. and everybody was nice and correct with us, be they Romanian, Hungarians or Roma.

Last edited by Tulun; September 22nd, 2017 at 07:58 PM.
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Old September 22nd, 2017, 09:11 PM   #52

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it is not necessary a step toward independence, there are a lot of autnomous regions in Europe that stopped there, of course it would partly also depend on the future developement of the ethnic relations, but imo the geographical circumstances would always make it practically impossible to make it idependent.



nah, i think the motive is the same, they don't want to leave their birthplace for the same reason why the Romanians didn't want to leave it a century ago. Because they may don't like the state above them, but love their birthplace. It was just a silly suggestion to ask them why don't they move away. Normally people leave their homeland only in case of physical danger to their existence.
Many other autonomous regions in the wrong stop there as well.
Can you imagine Navajo nation becoming a country?
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Old September 22nd, 2017, 09:21 PM   #53
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I've known some countries before independence and after

A common trait seems to be imposition of the local language vs the previous language (even when a majority of the local population did not actually speak the local language) as this seems to "burn the bridges" to the previous country.

Some of the advantages:
local political elite benefits (as in "its better to be the king of your village than a minor politician in a big a country")
local economy is protected to some degree (for example local banks, local telecom companies etc... the new capital's airport becomes a hub)
no financial transfers to the central government

Some of the disadvantages
less political leverage (because of smaller size)
less economical scale (for example banks are small and vulnerable because they serve a smaller local market)
no financial transfers FROM the central government
extra expenses (local politicians, diplomats, defense forces)
weaker military
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Old September 22nd, 2017, 10:18 PM   #54

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i remember a few rough parts socialist block buildings shocked me when we accidently stopped at Barót/Baraolt
In Târgu Mureș / Marosvásárhely, there's a rather sudden transition from stuff like this:

Click the image to open in full size.

to this:

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old September 23rd, 2017, 12:15 AM   #55

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The last two paragraphs contradict the first one.
They don't: unlike in other countries, the knowledge of the three official languages isn't compulsory in Belgium.

Which is stupid, if You ask me. It's one of the important reasons of tensions between the two communities, IMHO.
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Old September 23rd, 2017, 12:23 AM   #56

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They don't: unlike in other countries, the knowledge of the three official languages isn't compulsory in Belgium.

Which is stupid, if You ask me. It's one of the important reasons of tensions between the two communities, IMHO.
Compulsory for whom? Citizens or people with certain jobs?
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Old September 23rd, 2017, 12:40 AM   #57

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Compulsory for whom? Citizens or people with certain jobs?
Citizens.

The other official language (I don't even mention German and Germans - most Belgians even ignore that there's a third official language and that there are not two but three communities) is treated as a foreign language in the school. In Wallonia, there's usually only one foreign language thought in school, and parents/students are given the choice between English and Flemish.

Ofcourse, the vast majority are choosing English.

PS: in Brussels it's different, as it's the only bi-lingual region, thus Flemish knowledge is much more presented amongst Francophones.
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Old September 23rd, 2017, 12:42 AM   #58

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Citizens.

The other official language (I don't even mention German and Germans - most Belgians even ignore that there's a third official language and that there are not two but three communities) is treated as a foreign language in the school. In Wallonia, there's usually only one foreign language thought in school, and parents/students are given the choice between English and Flemish.

Ofcourse, the vast majority are choosing English.

PS: in Brussels it's different, as it's the only bi-lingual region, thus Flemish knowledge is much more presented amongst Francophones.
You got the wrong newspaper this morning and you can't resolve the crosswords, didn't you?
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Old September 23rd, 2017, 12:46 AM   #59

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You got the wrong newspaper this morning and you can't resolve the crosswords, didn't you?
Nah, I've got the wrong thread and I fell on an Internet zombie.
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