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Philosophy, Political Science, and Sociology Philosophy, Political Science, and Sociology Forum - Perennial Ideas and Debates that cross societal/time boundaries


View Poll Results: Would be morally acceptable to give such potion?
Yes 6 20.69%
No 23 79.31%
Voters: 29. You may not vote on this poll

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Old November 20th, 2012, 08:52 AM   #31

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Maybe she would be happy, but it would be a happiness based on a lie. I can't see how this would be ethical.
Is promoting happiness with lies always unethical?
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Old November 20th, 2012, 02:42 PM   #32

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Originally Posted by The merchant of Venice View Post
Is promoting happiness with lies always unethical?
In the case of adults it is. Sometimes we don't tell children the truth to shield them until they are older and can handle it better, but this is different.

Do you feel it is okay to do this?
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Old November 20th, 2012, 03:03 PM   #33

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(From the movie AI)
Now, I'm gonna read some words, and…uh...they won't make any
sense, but I want you to listen to them anyway. And...look
at me all the time. Can you do that?

Yes, Monica.
Can you feel my hand on the back of your neck?
Yes.
Does any of this hurt?
No.

Okay. Now. Look at me? Ready?
Cirrus. Socrates. Particle. Decibel. Hurricane. Dolphin. Tulip.
Monica. David. Monica.

All right…I wonder if I did that right. I don’t-

What were those words for, Mommy?
What did you call me?
Mommy.
Who am I, David?
You are my Mommy.

"Real" love vs "Programmed" love
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Old November 20th, 2012, 03:12 PM   #34

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I have heard a lot from date rape drugs are they the same thing. Its been going on in history for a long time, Like it was said that Edward IV had been handed a potion that had made him infatuated with Elizabeth Woodville.
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Old November 20th, 2012, 03:15 PM   #35
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It seems to me that the premise answers the moral dilemma. If a potion existed that eliminated the existing will of an individual and reconfigured it to show amorous affection towards a specific individual, it seems that this potion's very existence would undermine the principle of free will; thus rendering all moral arguments predicated on the existence of free will moot. This leaves us with one viable philosophical system: determinism. And if the world is deterministic, you never really had a choice between giving the potion or not giving it and, if you had no choice, how could it be morally unacceptable?
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Old November 20th, 2012, 03:17 PM   #36

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Then there's simple Beer.... making ugly people fall in love for centuries.
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Old November 21st, 2012, 05:19 AM   #37

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake10 View Post
In the case of adults it is. Sometimes we don't tell children the truth to shield them until they are older and can handle it better, but this is different.

Do you feel it is okay to do this?
What if one of your friend like to paint, and since you're a art history professor he asks you to tell him if his works are good. Let's say they're terrible: would you tell him the truth or lie?

Another example: your mother takes Homeopathy medicine. You know homeopathy is garbage and doesn't do anything, however, due to placebo the medicines have some effects, would you tell your mother the truth just to appease your own ideals, thus destroying a useful effect, or just be silent about it?

I think this second example in particular is interesting, since it underlines the fact that it can be more selfish to just follow one own ideals, just to appease conscience.
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Old November 21st, 2012, 05:23 AM   #38

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Quote:
Originally Posted by constantine View Post
It seems to me that the premise answers the moral dilemma. If a potion existed that eliminated the existing will of an individual and reconfigured it to show amorous affection towards a specific individual, it seems that this potion's very existence would undermine the principle of free will; thus rendering all moral arguments predicated on the existence of free will moot. This leaves us with one viable philosophical system: determinism. And if the world is deterministic, you never really had a choice between giving the potion or not giving it and, if you had no choice, how could it be morally unacceptable?
Interesting, but why would the potion existence remove the concept of free will? The fact that A being able to remove B exists doesn't necessary mean that in the absence of A B doesn't exist
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Old November 21st, 2012, 02:51 PM   #39

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Quote:
Originally Posted by The merchant of Venice View Post
What if one of your friend like to paint, and since you're a art history professor he asks you to tell him if his works are good. Let's say they're terrible: would you tell him the truth or lie?

Another example: your mother takes Homeopathy medicine. You know homeopathy is garbage and doesn't do anything, however, due to placebo the medicines have some effects, would you tell your mother the truth just to appease your own ideals, thus destroying a useful effect, or just be silent about it?

I think this second example in particular is interesting, since it underlines the fact that it can be more selfish to just follow one own ideals, just to appease conscience.
The key to dealing with this is knowing how to educate people, which is not by lying. Letting an amateur know that his/her work needs improvement can be done is a productive manner without lying. This would not deter the person from getting better, in fact it can encourage the person to improve. In the end, if you don't tell the painter the truth, sooner or later someone else will, and there is nothing worse than believing you're good when you're not.

In the case of the medicine, educating is once again the key to this. Teaching my mother that she can influence herself to become better without medicine is the best way to deal with this.
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Old November 22nd, 2012, 04:32 AM   #40

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake10 View Post
The key to dealing with this is knowing how to educate people, which is not by lying. Letting an amateur know that his/her work needs improvement can be done is a productive manner without lying. This would not deter the person from getting better, in fact it can encourage the person to improve. In the end, if you don't tell the painter the truth, sooner or later someone else will, and there is nothing worse than believing you're good when you're not.

In the case of the medicine, educating is once again the key to this. Teaching my mother that she can influence herself to become better without medicine is the best way to deal with this.
Good in theory, but that's not always applicable. What if your mother is old and simply won't understand? Would in that case removing a beneficial effect worth it?
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