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Old January 9th, 2011, 10:44 AM   #1

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What if Rome never fell?


I'm not sure if this has been discussed before or not, but I've always found it interesting to think about. What would the world look like today if the Roman empire had never fallen? Would the Romans have eventually discovered America? Would they have taken over North and even South America as well? How would battles have been fought? What would have the Romans done about Islam (if it had ever become a major religion)? What about war, what kind of weapons would be used? Would we still be fighting with swords in 2011; or would firearms eventually be created?

Basically anything goes, what do YOU think would happen?
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Old January 9th, 2011, 10:47 AM   #2

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Muslim would not have emerged and Sassanid Persia would have been Christianized.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 11:07 AM   #3

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Western Empire:
I think there's no way they could have kept the Iberian peninsula or northern Africa. So it would end up being the size of modern day Italy for a while. Though since the heart of the Catholic Church is in Rome, it could still have a lot of influence over Western Europe. And, if they could have gotten the Africa province back, (like with the pope asking other kingdoms to help or with the Eastern Roman Empire's help). With the resources of Northen Africa, they could have retaken some of their old territory (such as the Iberian Peninsula or parts of Gaul).

Eastern Empire:
The biggest reason for the fall of the Eastern empire is betrayal. They lost a couple key battles to the Turks because of people wanting the throne for themselves. You take that element out, then they have a good chance of retaking Asia Minor. That could have helped kept the Eastern Roman Empire around for quite some time. And that would eliminate the future influence of the Ottomans.

They could have also offered a lot more help to the Crusader states, which could have tipped the balance of power in favor of the crusaders. And they could have kept the water ways clear for the Crusaders.

With the resources of Greece and Asia Minor, they could have expanded further into the Middle East. Perhaps even taking the Crusader states (should they choose to turn on the Western European kingdoms) and Egypt. Since they were on good terms with the early Russian kingdom, they could have worked with the Czars against other Eastern European kingdoms. Dividing up all of Eastern Europe between the two of them.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 11:10 AM   #4

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Labienus View Post
Muslim would not have emerged and Sassanid Persia would have been Christianized.
Islam came about before the fall of either Roman Empire. And the Eastern Empire probably wouldn't have tried to stop the Arab tribes from conquering Persia.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 11:14 AM   #5

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Quote:
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Islam came about before the fall of either Roman Empire. And the Eastern Empire probably wouldn't have tried to stop the Arab tribes from conquering Persia.
When did Islam came out then?
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Old January 9th, 2011, 11:27 AM   #6

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When did Islam came out then?
Around 500AD. I was wrong about both empires still being around, since the Western one fell in 476AD, but the Eastern Empire was still strong at the time.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 11:36 AM   #7

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow Dragon View Post
Around 500AD. I was wrong about both empires still being around, since the Western one fell in 476AD, but the Eastern Empire was still strong at the time.
Indeed it lasted to the 15th Century I believe.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 04:13 PM   #8
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I think this question needs to be narrowed down based on when you want to intervene with history.

Depending on the time, Rome could stretch from Britain and Spain to deep into Mesopotamia or be confined almost entirely to the walls of Constantinople.

It could be one unified empire, two empires, or even three empires during the Crisis of the 3rd Century.

It's really hard to tell where things were headed as well. For example, as late as 460 the Western Roman Empire looked like it was making a comeback under Majorian, who secured Italy, reclaimed much of Gaul and Spain, and was on the verge of leading an invasion of Vandal North Africa when his fleet was destroyed by sabotage.

On another note, the advent of Islam wasn't until the 620s AD
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Old January 9th, 2011, 04:29 PM   #9

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On another note, the advent of Islam wasn't until the 620s AD
Thats what I also think, I never heard of Islam existing in the 6th century before Shadow dragon said it.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 04:40 PM   #10

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There's no doubt that Rome would have continued expanding, but what really makes me curious is what might have happened when the clash between Rome and China would have come. The Romans liked to assimilate cultures, but the Chinese would have seen resisted, thinking their own culture superior. The population counts would have affected this a great deal. And what about Japan? Would the Romans have succeeded where the Mongols failed?
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