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Old January 24th, 2011, 03:24 AM   #1

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What if Hitler didn't make the decision to invade Russia


how does everyone think world war 2 would have ended if hitler hadnt made the decision to invade russia?

would russia have declared war on germany later on anyway, would germany have instead consolodated their power over central europe instead?

what does everyone think?
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Old January 24th, 2011, 07:22 AM   #2
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A very interesting question, because they lost the war in Russia.
But they hated comunism, they wanted to control these lands, and they were supported by Catholic church, that wanted to control Russia and principally Orthodox church too.
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Old January 24th, 2011, 07:58 AM   #3

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I think a confrontation between the Nazis and Soviets was inevitable. The Nazis were ardent anti-communists and they considered Slavs as inferior. The Soviets considered all of the Western nations a threat (with good reason)

The Germans tried several times, prior to and during the war, to unite other factions in a fight against Communism. Even if they hadn't invaded in '41 but waited until some kind of peace with the UK was realized, would of eventually turned to deal with the Soviets.

The Soviets might not of waited to much longer before they attacked Germany to prevent an anti-Communist coalition from forming in the West. Part of the reasoning behind the massive effort at rapid industrialization was to be prepared for upcoming wars against the enemies of the State.
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Old January 24th, 2011, 08:08 AM   #4

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Soviets would invade Germany. The pact they'd made after 1938 was only because Stalin realised that as of yet he could not face the Nazi's and iirc I remember reading that the Soviets were planning to have their army back on track by 1942?
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Old January 24th, 2011, 08:34 AM   #5

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaius valerius View Post
I remember reading that the Soviets were planning to have their army back on track by 1942?
yes that was when the last 5 year plan would be completed which concentrated on the military. hitler was obsessed with russia there was no way he was going to not invade. as he saw it and he was right as well is that the longer he delayed the invasion the more time he was giving the soviets to beef up there army. its interesting to think what may have happened if hitler had held off the attack until they were ready but before they attacked the russians launched a preemptive attack, wonder which side history would paint as the bad guys
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Old January 24th, 2011, 08:36 AM   #6

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Russia would have invaded Germany.
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Old January 24th, 2011, 08:38 AM   #7

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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishcrusader95 View Post
yes that was when the last 5 year plan would be completed which concentrated on the military. hitler was obsessed with russia there was no way he was going to not invade. as he saw it and he was right as well is that the longer he delayed the invasion the more time he was giving the soviets to beef up there army. its interesting to think what may have happened if hitler had held off the attack until they were ready but before they attacked the russians launched a preemptive attack, wonder which side history would paint as the bad guys
Forget where I saw it but heard 1943 mentioned as a likely year which would make sense if they planned for some time to organize the actual attack after the 5 yr plans finished
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Old January 24th, 2011, 09:22 AM   #8

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Moved to Speculative History.
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Old January 24th, 2011, 10:22 AM   #9

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sorry for posting in the wrong section.

i agree that conflict between the two was inevitable at some point and it suited the russians to let germany act as the aggressor so that other countries would unite against germany.
i hadnt heard of the 5 year plan before but it makes sense considering the amount of arms and quality of these by the end of the war, especially the tanks.

i think its very interesting too in the point about what would have happened had russia declared war on germany instead and how the world would have taken this.

how do we all think the war in russia would have gone without hitlers constant meddling in the tactics etc of the werhmacht, or was the result just inevitable?
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Old January 24th, 2011, 10:37 AM   #10

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what would have happened had russia declared war on germany instead and how the world would have taken this.
Well, the world wouldn't have minded the Soviets declaring war (since it would've actually helped the Allies). Then again, Historians would view that the Soviets would've been 'the dishonest partner' in their little deal.

Quote:
how do we all think the war in russia would have gone without hitlers constant meddling in the tactics etc of the werhmacht, or was the result just inevitable?
Ah... a tricky question. By you stating that Hitler weren't to be involved, then Operation Barbarossa wouldn't have occurred (Hitler's Generals advised against the invasion , citing a Napoleon-type failure).
If Hitler did follow his Generals views; the Germans would've had better equipment ( to give them proper winter clothing), the German offensive would've been much more successful (Hitler wouldn't have 'misplaced' all his tanks and brigade..).

Basically speaking, Hitler would've had a higher probability of winning if he had in fact listened to his Generals. Keep in mind that the Soviets are yet to be mobilised and once they do, it would appear to be a slow stalemate (although it would occur at a later period).

I apologise if I didn't specify much, I'm very tired right now
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