Historum - History Forums  

Go Back   Historum - History Forums > Themes in History > Speculative History
Register Forums Blogs Social Groups Mark Forums Read

Speculative History Speculative History Forum - Alternate History, What If Questions, Pseudo History, and anything outside the boundaries of mainstream historical research


View Poll Results: Independence of Catalonia
Support - Independent from the EU 9 23.08%
Support - As a member of the EU 12 30.77%
Oppose 12 30.77%
Unsure 6 15.38%
Voters: 39. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old November 8th, 2012, 03:07 PM   #1

Irish Yankee's Avatar
Archivist
 
Joined: Jul 2012
From: Penn's Woods
Posts: 138
Catalonian Independence


I am curious if the members of this forum would support/oppose the independence of Catalonia from Spain. I would especially like to here from members from Spain.
Irish Yankee is offline  
Remove Ads
Old November 9th, 2012, 01:17 AM   #2

Linschoten's Avatar
nonpareil
 
Joined: Aug 2010
From: Wessex
Posts: 10,254
Blog Entries: 11

I can't make a meaningful vote here because it's for the Catalonians to decide; personally I think it would be a pity if they withdrew from Spain, just as I think it would be a pity if Scotland withdrew from the UK. From any objective point of view, the loss of Catalonia would be much more serious for Spain than the loss of Scotland would be for the UK.
Linschoten is online now  
Old November 9th, 2012, 01:37 AM   #3
Scholar
 
Joined: Sep 2012
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Posts: 683

Personally, I don't care so much, and find ethnonationalism a bit silly. Regardless of whether it seeks and gains independence, Catalonia will remain the in EU, the EFTA and the Schengen zone, so it will make little practical difference to most of us in the EU. Spaniards and Catalonians will still have freedom of movement and right to work and settle on either side of the border, as will everyone else in the EFTA.

The important question that everyone seems to be ignoring, is whether Catalonia will have an independent Football Association and if so, will Barcelona still play in La Liga? I don't to lose the El Classico. Will they set up their own international team and, if so, will they be able to ?convince the likes of Alonso and Pique to play for them rather than stay with Spain - probably the best team in the world? A whole can of worms.
Kaficek is offline  
Old November 9th, 2012, 08:31 AM   #4

Irish Yankee's Avatar
Archivist
 
Joined: Jul 2012
From: Penn's Woods
Posts: 138

The decission would be Catalonia's to make and I would support whatever they decide, however I struggle to see the point if they would remain in the EU. Essentially, this would be trading Madrid for Brussels. Same goes for Scotland and Venice, why seperate from one nation and still remain in the EU? Very little real sovereignty would be gained.
Irish Yankee is offline  
Old November 9th, 2012, 08:57 AM   #5

1991sudarshan's Avatar
Historian
 
Joined: Jun 2011
From: São Tomé de Meliapore
Posts: 1,738

Catalonians are not willing to allow the Spanish authorities to spend their money to bail out the other parts of the Spain. The same goes to the Scotland case. We may hear the emergence of the Basque Country soon.
1991sudarshan is offline  
Old November 9th, 2012, 10:38 AM   #6

Linschoten's Avatar
nonpareil
 
Joined: Aug 2010
From: Wessex
Posts: 10,254
Blog Entries: 11

That's not a good parallel, because Catalonia makes a much bigger contribution to the Spanish economy. In the case of Scotland, the revenues drawn from Scotland and the expenditure made there are probably about in balance, and more is spent per head in Scotland than in England.
Linschoten is online now  
Old November 9th, 2012, 10:51 AM   #7
Suspended indefinitely
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 19,934

When any local identity unit is part of any greater unit, people must understand that the resources of all must be for all.

On one hand, from a purely historical, linguistic and cultural standpoint, Catalonia has alll the right of the World of feeling themselves peculiar and different of anyone else.

In fact, IMHO exponentially more than plenty of currently autonomous collectivities of let say eastern Europe.

On the other hand, Spain as a whole (not just Madrid, Valencia or Barcelona) has improved significantly on most areas from let say the end of their Civil War.

If not a major power, it is at least a first world country.

I can't understand why anyone would like to deliberately spoil such notable achievements by mere gratuitous Balkanization.

Especially when the example of so many recently Balkanized nations is so eloquently available.

Just IMHO.

Our Lins is right, it is naturally just the decision of the involved parties, i.e. Catalonians in particular & Spaniards in general.

Guess something analogous could be said about let say Quebec & Canada...


PS: BTW, IMHO this thread shouldn't be in the Speculative (Alternative) History Forum
Just IMHO

Last edited by sylla1; November 9th, 2012 at 12:37 PM.
sylla1 is offline  
Old November 9th, 2012, 10:52 AM   #8

flaxman's Avatar
Scholar
 
Joined: Nov 2010
From: England
Posts: 804

There is no automatic entry into the EU. Any new country would probably have to apply for entry into the EU.

From Scotsman today: Joaquín Almunia, vice-president of the European Commission, said “if a state separates itself, that part will be outside” and will have to start the process of adhesion from zero. He added that there are “2,000 ways that this could be vetoed”.
flaxman is offline  
Old November 9th, 2012, 10:58 AM   #9

Linschoten's Avatar
nonpareil
 
Joined: Aug 2010
From: Wessex
Posts: 10,254
Blog Entries: 11

Though I can't see why they'd want to veto it in the final resort.
Linschoten is online now  
Old November 9th, 2012, 02:57 PM   #10
Historian
 
Joined: Nov 2010
From: Hungary
Posts: 2,038

its up to the Catalans, personally i would be happy to see it together with independent Basque country, i always had sympathy for them. i also dont really see who would want to oppose their membership in the EU, their separatist parties are pro-EU as i understand, their existing laws are already EU confrom, they use euro, they pay to and recieve money already from EU funds. If lets say Spain would veto their admission it would also harm Spanish economy, not having the 4 freedoms (free movement of goods, capital, services, people) with the richest part of the Iberian penninsula.
Tulun is online now  
Reply

  Historum > Themes in History > Speculative History

Tags
catalonian, independence


Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Independence Qymaen General History 18 June 28th, 2011 02:44 AM
no independence for the usa bartieboy Speculative History 13 December 30th, 2010 06:36 PM

Copyright © 2006-2013 Historum. All rights reserved.