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Old December 7th, 2012, 12:59 AM   #11

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I would assume everybody believes in science. If science is faith, then would it not also be a spiritual conception?
Then you assume falsely. There are still people who believe the world is flat, that evolution is bunk and the US faked the landings on the Moon. Plus a dizzying plethora of even more extremely creative expressions of imaginative thought. Which every single one of them has the intrinsic right to hold, but not force onto everyone else.
Science too is actually matter of faith. You must have faith in the discoveries of science to truly accept what Science maintains. However, Science attempts to explain physical phenomena through experimentation, mathematics and repeatable processes. Which is what Science is all about and for. Science is not infallible either. Science is constantly evolving as are all other forms of information. It is anyone's guess if science will ever be able to answer all humanity's questions.
Faith is more about those aspects of existence that are sensed but cannot be accessed by physical, mathematical or experimental procedures. Those things that emerge from the philosophies of the imagination but do not include any aspects of tangible physicality. This is what spirituality is for. And faith is at the core of spirituality as well as science.


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The conflict between science and faith to me seems to be our own egos
There should be no conflict between Science and Spirituality (faith) as they a both aspects of the human capacity to imagine what may or may not be possible. Both are important arenas of human thought. Ones that are beginning to fuse together. Especially when it comes to concepts that science presents, but fully knows it will never be able to undeniably prove. This type of presentation always requires faith.
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Old December 7th, 2012, 05:40 AM   #12

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Originally Posted by Zarin
Then you assume falsely. There are still people who believe the world is flat, that evolution is bunk and the US faked the landings on the Moon. Plus a dizzying plethora of even more extremely creative expressions of imaginative thought. Which every single one of them has the intrinsic right to hold, but not force onto everyone else.
Though I assume they watch tv, use computers/ the internet, go see doctors, and don't assume that all of this operates by magic. People who beef with science only seem to disagree with a tiny fraction of scientific conclusions, they don't disagree with the methodology mind you. For example fundamentalists who don't like scientists saying evolution is true will often rail against science on Facebook . . . from their iPad, while getting immunization shots . . . so really, they believe in science just as much as anyone else.

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There should be no conflict between Science and Spirituality (faith) as they a both aspects of the human capacity to imagine what may or may not be possible. Both are important arenas of human thought. Ones that are beginning to fuse together.
What is interesting is that they've always been fused together. The modern conflict mainly originates in a certain authoritative institution not wanting to accept that it is really not an authority on the operation of reality.
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Old December 7th, 2012, 11:21 AM   #13

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Though I assume they watch tv, use computers/ the internet, go see doctors, and don't assume that all of this operates by magic. People who beef with science only seem to disagree with a tiny fraction of scientific conclusions, they don't disagree with the methodology mind you. For example fundamentalists who don't like scientists saying evolution is true will often rail against science on Facebook . . . from their iPad, while getting immunization shots . . . so really, they believe in science just as much as anyone else.
You be surprised what everyone assumes. People use many services provided by scientific expertise but do not understand or wish to understand what lies behind the creation of these services. Everyone assumes that their doctor, dentist or car repairman is competent, but they have no real way of knowing if this is in fact true. A degree or certificate is no guarantee. Especially if they have no specific references for such competency. However, services such as Angie's list and the Better Business Bureau are there to help weed out those with the most complaints against their competence.
People buy a device not knowing how it actually works but assume that when they plug it in and press a button or switch that the device will operate as specified. I have no idea how a High definition TV works as long as it does.
Believing in a service often is necessary as there may be no other viable options. For the longest time Las Vegas had only one cable service. If you wanted cable, you had to use this particular service. And the management became very insensitive and extremely arrogant. Now that there is plenty of competition, this monopoly is having a very hard time staying in business.

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What is interesting is that they've always been fused together. The modern conflict mainly originates in a certain authoritative institution not wanting to accept that it is really not an authority on the operation of reality.
Not really, Although they both have the intention of providing answers to the many questions that exist in the human mind. The methodology of each is really very different. With Science you have to prove that it works. With Spirituality you only have to believe it.
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Old December 7th, 2012, 11:42 AM   #14

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and the US faked the landings on the Moon.
The landings were real. The takeoffs from the moon were faked.
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Old December 7th, 2012, 11:48 AM   #15

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The landings were real. The takeoffs from the moon were faked.
Because of the way you "edited" my post, you made it look like I support this erroneous viewpoint. Please do not do this in the future. It is an old political trick and is often used to make what people say look incorrect. It is called "spin."
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Old December 8th, 2012, 12:11 PM   #16

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Not saying that it was a fake, but that 'flag waving in the wind' bit does intrigue me, I have to admit.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 07:51 PM   #17
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Not saying that it was a fake, but that 'flag waving in the wind' bit does intrigue me, I have to admit.
the flag 'waving' in the 'wind' was actualy just movement started into motion my the handling of the flag pole. The movement mostly stops when the flag is finished being planted...the continued movement is just momentum in an almost friction free environment
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