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Old April 14th, 2017, 12:32 PM   #21
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If Germany had committed similar forces to those involved in Barbarossa, it is highly probable that through weight of numbers they would have prevailed. The British had a formidable navy and air force, but as Russia proved there is a telling factor in numbers; seamen and pilots are only human, they can only take so much.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 12:35 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by CPTANT View Post
Well not invading Russia means vastly more resources can be spend on the battle of the Atlantic and since the luftwaffe isn't needed on the Eastern Front there could be a buildup for future raids on the UK.

Germany could have also kicked the UK out of the Mediterranean, Northern Africa and the Middle East.
Exactly. Fortunately it never came to that but I can't imagine that Britain could have held out indefinitely against the concentrated efforts of Germany with all of Europe's resources available to it. I'm not saying it would have been quick or easy.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 01:19 PM   #23
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If Germany had committed similar forces to those involved in Barbarossa, it is highly probable that through weight of numbers they would have prevailed. The British had a formidable navy and air force, but as Russia proved there is a telling factor in numbers; seamen and pilots are only human, they can only take so much.
Are all those German soldiers going to swim the Channel ?
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Old April 14th, 2017, 01:22 PM   #24
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I can understand that Sealion might not have been successful in 1940. What I find impossible to believe is that Britain could have held out indefinitely against a Nazi Germany that didn't choose to get distracted by attacking Russia.
Had it been about conquering Britain and not the USSR, then yes, Britain could not hold out indefinitely against Nazi Germany - which could build enough U-boats to starve Britain out

But I don't think it would ever come to that

FDR would have found a reason to intervene.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 01:26 PM   #25
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Are all those German soldiers going to swim the Channel ?
Germany nearly defeated Britain in the Battle of the Atlantic in 1943 when they were fighting in the Mediterranean and against Russia and by which time the US had been in the war for well over a year. They wouldn't have needed to swim the Channel.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 01:37 PM   #26
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And that's the nub...

Faced with the largest navy in the world at the time, there was no way Germany could invade

To echo the words of a previous Sea Lord..."I cannot promise that the enemy will not come...all I promise is that he hill not come by sea"
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Are all those German soldiers going to swim the Channel ?
If they had continued throwing planes at British airports and radar stations, if they had attacked British shipping across the Atlantic and in the , if they had used mass paratroop drops , then eventually... eventually they would have prevailed. Without having to worry about Russia, they could have concentrated their vast resources on a country that couldn't afford to lose a single pilot. The Channel Islands are very close to the English coast, and with their capture, and with almost unlimited resources, you wouldn't be backing Churchill over Hitler.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 01:52 PM   #27

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If they had continued throwing planes at British airports and radar stations, if they had attacked British shipping across the Atlantic and in the , if they had used mass paratroop drops , then eventually... eventually they would have prevailed. Without having to worry about Russia, they could have concentrated their vast resources on a country that couldn't afford to lose a single pilot. The Channel Islands are very close to the English coast, and with their capture, and with almost unlimited resources, you wouldn't be backing Churchill over Hitler.
Mass parachute drops, really. On an island, with your only supplies coming by air and no chance of support from ground forces.

Might as well just put them against a wall and shot them, save the fuel.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 02:03 PM   #28

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The Channel Islands are very close to the English coast, and with their capture, and with almost unlimited resources, you wouldn't be backing Churchill over Hitler.
You need to look at a map, parts of the French and Belgium coasts are far closer to England than the Channel Isles.
In fact, the Channel Isles are so far from the British Isles compared to their position to the French coast they are not geographically considered to be part of the British Isles archipelago.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 02:03 PM   #29
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Mass parachute drops, really. On an island, with your only supplies coming by air and no chance of support from ground forces.

Might as well just put them against a wall and shot them, save the fuel.
I'm curious. Accepting that an assault comprising entirely of paratroops would not succeed are you saying that Britain could have held off Germany indefinitely if the USSR and the US weren't with us? That means a Battle of the Atlantic without American shipyards, long-range aircraft and convoy escorts. The RN and RAF's admirable qualities would be useless without oil coming in in tankers.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 02:18 PM   #30
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How Exactly?
In 1941 Britain is building more cargo tonnage than U-boats can sink, and they've already failed in the BoB.
They lack the means to invade Britain
I share your thoughts on this. The Luftwaffe which shall give air cover to their crossing forces and supply was out matched by the RAF. The German infantry which was bigger than British at that time will only be effective if able to land in Britain and shall be provided with enough supply, which shall never happen in view of manifest failure of Luftwaffe to destroy the RAF.
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