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Old June 27th, 2012, 03:12 PM   #91

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The Duxford collection was ok. But nothing compared to Bovvy. To be honest, i was pretty dissapointed with the Duxford collection full stop.

I don't know so much. Duxford has examples of all the key stuff, and it's laid out pretty well, unlike the overcrowded air halls (can't get decent angles for photos).

Of course, it is not as extensive as Bovington, but the Tank Museum is the armoured equivalent of the British Library!
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Old June 27th, 2012, 03:13 PM   #92

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Its been a while since i was there, last time i looked it was conqueror, T-34, JS2 and a T55 in a shed out the back, anything would be an improvement.

I have to to back there sometime or actually make the effort and get down to Bovington.
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Old June 27th, 2012, 03:14 PM   #93

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I don't know so much. Duxford has examples of all the key stuff, and it's laid out pretty well, unlike the overcrowded air halls (can't get decent angles for photos).

Of course, it is not as extensive as Bovington, but the Tank Museum is the armoured equivalent of the British Library!
Ye, sorry, i wasn't to clear. I wasn't that impresed with the aircraft collection.
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Old June 27th, 2012, 03:16 PM   #94

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Its been a while since i was there, last time i looked it was conqueror, T-34, JS2 and a T55 in a shed out the back, anything would be an improvement.

I have to to back there sometime or actually make the effort and get down to Bovington.
They have a nedw building at the far end with all the armour, It includes an early Pz IV, a Hetzer, StuG, warrior and quite a few other's. Its a nice display.
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Old June 27th, 2012, 03:24 PM   #95

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Its been a while since i was there, last time i looked it was conqueror, T-34, JS2 and a T55 in a shed out the back, anything would be an improvement.

I have to to back there sometime or actually make the effort and get down to Bovington.
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They have a nedw building at the far end with all the armour, It includes an early Pz IV, a Hetzer, StuG, warrior and quite a few other's. Its a nice display.
But there's still stacks of modern stuff parked up outside, mostly loot from OP GRANBY (DESERT STORM to the cousins) by the look of it. There's a piece of the Super Gun in the US Aircraft Hall, as well.

Good day out, even if you can't get the photo angles
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Old June 27th, 2012, 05:09 PM   #96

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The Jagd Tiger was a hunting tank also and not an assault gun but I take your point - the Tiger II was the heaviest turreted tank ever built (the Maus V1 / V2 excepted). That would mean surrendering in the West and fighting on in the East. I'm not sure how that would have affected morale on the Eastern front.
I don't they ever got a Maus V1/V2 built, did they? Even if they did, if it was heavier then the Tiger II, it wouldn't have been very mobile and an easy targert for various Allied bombers.

I wouldn't call it formal "surrender" as I don't thin the Western Allies would have accepted a formal surrender that allowed the Germans to keep fighting the Soviet Union, but by simply not fighting in the west, you're probably right. It would be a surrender in everything except the name.

I'm not quite sure what it would do on the Eastern Front. I'd assume that with the reinforcements and units that Hitler hopelessly squandered in the Bulge, the Wehrmacht, as depleated as it was by late 1944 to early 1945 would have held off the Soviets in Prussia and the region leading up to the river Oder a bit longer. By that time, with no opposition, glory hungry generals like Patton or Montgomery would push for some Western Allied push on the German capital while there was no obvious opposition.

What the exact morale situation would be, I'm not entirely sure.
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Old June 27th, 2012, 06:08 PM   #97

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There was one built with an unarmed test turret and a functioning hull built for testing then a second completed with full armament. It was rolled out to be used against the Russians then promptly ate its own transmission and since there was othing onthe plnet powerful enough to retrive it, it was detonated by the crew.

The test hull and the surviving prouction turet from the self-destructed tank were then fitted together by the soviets and sent off to Kubinka to be tested, its still sitting in a display gallery.
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Old June 27th, 2012, 11:41 PM   #98

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Unless it's already been mentioned The US-German Tank Battle of Arracourt
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Old June 28th, 2012, 01:42 AM   #99

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Sorry but Arracourt cant be taken into serious account, the german armoured convoy was advancing through a muddy road in a heavily wooded forest, the American armour easily ambushed them at close ranges of atleast 100 meters, gaining not only a first-shot advantage, but also a surprise advantage, a cover advantage, a Flanking advantage (They fired from both sides, so if a german tank wheels to face one side its most velunarble part-the rear would be exposed to the other side) at the close range in which they engaged the battle was fairly simple, the tank that fires first wins as most calibers penetrated at that range. the germans not only got fired on by enemies they are COMPLETELY oblivious to and still cant locate them, they also had their flanks wide open. they advanced blindly into an enemy they cant see in the heavy fog, and obviously met a disasterous end.
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Old June 28th, 2012, 05:41 PM   #100

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Maybe if the interval of bad weather became longer, Nazi could win the battle
cause without airpower, Allied force is nothing
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