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Old July 19th, 2012, 11:49 AM   #1

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Did Hitler have a chance Against USSR


From how I looked at it, it seems as if Hitler had none. USSR had too much industrial power and could not be taken so easily.

Hitler probably only attacked because he feared USSR was growing in strength.
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Old July 19th, 2012, 11:50 AM   #2
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The scenario is just Germany versus Russia? Not England or the US?
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Old July 19th, 2012, 11:56 AM   #3

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Originally Posted by Delenda est Roma View Post
The scenario is just Germany versus Russia? Not England or the US?
During the war, did Hitler have a chance from the beginning of Barbarosa
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Old July 19th, 2012, 11:58 AM   #4

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Originally Posted by emperor of seleucid View Post
From how I looked at it, it seems as if Hitler had none. USSR had too much industrial power and could not be taken so easily.
With hindsight, it's clear that the invasion was an immense gamble, and that logistically the German's were at an extreme disadvantage if the war wasn't a quick one.

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Hitler probably only attacked because he feared USSR was growing in strength.
Hitler attacked because he was always going to attempt to destroy the Soviet Union at some point. The fear that the Soviet Union was growing in strength only played a part in deciding when to attack.
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Old July 19th, 2012, 11:58 AM   #5
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That depends on a numbers of factors. Would the US have kept him supplied? And also if Hitler had been kept out of the decision making its very possible.
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Old July 19th, 2012, 12:17 PM   #6

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Hitler had every possible chance, if he lost it was his own doing.

The Soviets people welcomed the Germans with flowers as liberators.

By 22 June 1944 they'd had been under the communist regime for 24 years. Dozens of millions had been murdered, deported, persecuted, sent to concentration camps, lost their homes and watched their relatives die of hunger. In the wake of the Great Terror these guys had nothing to lose and nothing left to defend.

The figures are eloquent:

The number of Soviet soldiers who surrendered to the Germans in the first months after Barbaraossa: FOUR MILLION

According to NKVD statistics, by 10 October 1941 no less than 667,364 deserters from the Red Army soldiers had been caught.

The total number of deserters for 1941: over ONE MILLION.

A report of an NKVD partisan unit active in east Belarus in summer 1941: 90% of local men conscripted stayed at home.

Over 1,2 MILLION Soviet citizens volunteered to serve in the Wermacht, Waffen SS and German police formations. That's 10% of all soldiers serving in German uniforms in WWII.

Strictly courtesy of Stalin & Co, rulers of USSR.
It would be really hard to find another country in recorded history whose government has manged to piss off its citizens to such an extent.

It was Hitler not Stalin who defeated the Wermacht, and Hitler alone who saved the Stalinist regime - by his paranoid extermination policy towards the Slav popuation of the USSR. The best measure of brilliant Nazi policy on occupied Soviet territory is that within just a few months these unfortunate people were driven to such despair they began to fight fiercely for a bloody regime they detested.
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Old July 19th, 2012, 12:23 PM   #7

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Originally Posted by redcoat View Post
.

Hitler attacked because he was always going to attempt to destroy the Soviet Union at some point. The fear that the Soviet Union was growing in strength only played a part in deciding when to attack.
Don't forget that Stalin freezed oil supply to Germany when they purposely stalled giving technology to USSR. Stalin only continued the supply when Germany delivered their airplanes.

Waiting to invade meant that the USSR would have Nazi Technology as well as Industrial superiority.


The two states would clash eventually. I doubt USSR would sit there when Germany is making these conquests. Their showdown was enevitable.
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Old July 19th, 2012, 12:27 PM   #8

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Well, there was a possibility connected just with the attitude of many Russians: to leave untouched the south front, concentrating the military effort in the center / north part.

This [if Russians and Ukrainians in the south would have showed small "enthusiasm"] would have given a possibility to conquer Leningrad. Probably the siege of the city would have seen a different final result. And then, once Leningrad was fallen, Moscow was an easy target. May be after passing the winter along the sea.

Of course it would have been a total hazard: if US and UK aided USSR and Russians in the south would have moved north to take part to the defense of the "mother home land" [the Rodina] ... it would have been a defeat anyway.
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Old July 19th, 2012, 12:27 PM   #9

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Originally Posted by antonina View Post
Hitler had every possible chance, if he lost it was his own doing.

The Soviets people welcomed the Germans with flowers as liberators.

By 22 June 1944 they'd had been under the communist regime for 24 years. Dozens of millions had been murdered, deported, persecuted, sent to concentration camps, lost their homes and watched their relatives die of hunger. In the wake of the Great Terror these guys had nothing to lose and nothing left to defend.
It's kind of funny when you look at the primary sources at the time.

Kalashnikov was anxious to defend for his motherland. A boy collected an huge amount of scrap metal that could make many tanks. One soviet family donated a tank.

The Stalin stories have been exaggerated during the cold war. US were never so against the USSR during and before WWII
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Old July 19th, 2012, 12:28 PM   #10

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Originally Posted by AlpinLuke View Post
Well, there was a possibility connected just with the attitude of many Russians: to leave untouched the south front, concentrating the military effort in the center / north part.

This [if Russians and Ukrainians in the south would have showed small "enthusiasm"] would have give a possibility to conquer Leningrad. Probably the siege of the city would have seen a different final result. And then, once Leningrad was fallen, Moscow was an easy target. May be after passing the winter along the sea.

Of course it would have been a total hazard: if US and UK aided USSR and Russians in the south would have moved north to take part to the defense of the "mother home land" [the Rodina] ... it would have been a defeat anyway.
Southern Front was probably the most important.

As you know, now that Hitler had alienated USSR, they don't have an oil supply and it was estimated that Germany only produced 25% of their oil usage during the entire war.

THe caucus fields were vital.
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