A Soviet-British-French-Polish alliance before WW2

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
14,253
SoCal
#21
After initial terror after Stalin's death things were not that bad in Baltic republics. Industrialization was double edged sword for us, after break from Soviet Union vast majority of large factories have collapsed. They were so much integrated to Soviet Union economy, that with Russian blockade could not survive. Life actually is getting better here. With that demographic problems most likely will resolve themselves. Not many people talk about it, but for a lot of Belorussians and Ukrainians Baltic countries seem to be very attractive. I don't know why, if I was Ukrainian looking for place to emigrate I would choose Germany, not Lithuania. For whatever reason tens of thousands come looking for work already and if our politicians would make it easier hundreds of thousands would come. So, dream of Lithuanian nation state most likely will not survive for long, but no good place stays empty for long.
The loss of the Russian market can be compensated by integration with the rest of the EU, no?

Also, as long as Ukrainians and Belarusians will assimilate after they will move to Lithuania, I really don't see a problem with a lot of them moving to Lithuania.
 
Dec 2017
474
Australia
#22
Also, as long as Ukrainians and Belarusians will assimilate after they will move to Lithuania, I really don't see a problem with a lot of them moving to Lithuania.
Belarusians lived in south-eastern Lithuania forever. Their literary language is based partially on dialects spoken in south-eastern Lithuania. During Imperial Russia rule Vilnius governorate was what is approximately today north-western Belarus, south-eastern Lithuania.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e9/Lithuania-1867-1914-EN.svg
Vilna Governorate - Wikipedia

Also, in 1919 for around 5 months existed Litbel (Lithuanian-Belarusian Socialist Republic) . Poland dissolved it. : Lithuanian–Byelorussian Soviet Socialist Republic - Wikipedia

Integrating into Lithuanian community would not be a problem, as many Belarusians already have relatives living on the other side of the border in rural areas of south-eastern Lithuania. Another question wether or not Belarusians would want to settle in Lithuania, when highly paying cities such as Moscow or St Petersburg are more than happy to accept Belarusians. Language, education, healthcare, employment are no problems for Belarusian citizens in Russia.

Also, break in EU market is not always easy for former Soviet Republics. If Lithuania hasn't already, then unlikely it will. Many factories already are closed.
 
Last edited:
Dec 2017
474
Australia
#23
Demography of Vilna (Vilnius) governorate. Census of 1897. Of course, demography of the region changed drastically since 1897. Mass migration of Jews to US after WWI. Holocaust , mass migration of Jews beginning in 70s through to 90s in US and Israel. Poles were sent to Poland to settle the regions acquired from Germany after WWII. Many Russians came in Vilnius and Klaipeda during Soviet era.











Vilnia Uezd (area around Vilnius city totally within modern day borders of Lithuania)










 
Mar 2014
1,800
Lithuania
#24
Belarusians lived in south-eastern Lithuania forever. Their literary language is based partially on dialects spoken in south-eastern Lithuania. During Imperial Russia rule Vilnius governorate was what is approximately today north-western Belarus, south-eastern Lithuania.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e9/Lithuania-1867-1914-EN.svg
Vilna Governorate - Wikipedia

Also, in 1919 for around 5 months existed Litbel (Lithuanian-Belarusian Socialist Republic) . Poland dissolved it. : Lithuanian–Byelorussian Soviet Socialist Republic - Wikipedia

Integrating into Lithuanian community would not be a problem, as many Belarusians already have relatives living on the other side of the border in rural areas of south-eastern Lithuania. Another question wether or not Belarusians would want to settle in Lithuania, when highly paying cities such as Moscow or St Petersburg are more than happy to accept Belarusians. Language, education, healthcare, employment are no problems for Belarusian citizens in Russia.

Also, break in EU market is not always easy for former Soviet Republics. If Lithuania hasn't already, then unlikely it will. Many factories already are closed.
At the moment mostly Ukrainians are coming to work to Lithuania, Belorussians are more rare, but they are probably second most common foreign workers. You are wrong about Moscow and St. Petersburg it is very difficult for foreigners to come there and get decent wage etc... Everyone wants to go there so government makes it hard to move there, you need all king of permissions. Even for Russians it could be quite difficult move to those cities, of course there are plenty of illegals, but then you can only dream about good salary, health care etc.
 
Dec 2017
474
Australia
#25
At the moment mostly Ukrainians are coming to work to Lithuania, Belorussians are more rare, but they are probably second most common foreign workers. You are wrong about Moscow and St. Petersburg it is very difficult for foreigners to come there and get decent wage etc... Everyone wants to go there so government makes it hard to move there, you need all king of permissions. Even for Russians it could be quite difficult move to those cities, of course there are plenty of illegals, but then you can only dream about good salary, health care etc.
I know it's difficult for anyone, including Russians coming to Moscow and St Petersburg. I don't know why but Belarusians are welcomed by Russians in Moscow and St Petersburg. If you speak Russian, you can search on search engines on the subject. I am not kidding. Anyone wants to obtain Russian citizenship has to pass language and history tests. Belarusians don't have to. Because Belarusians speak Russian better than Russians themselves.

Why this is so? Because of союзное государство between Russia and Belarus.






Unlike people of other former republics citizens of Belarus have priviledges.
 
Mar 2014
1,800
Lithuania
#26
I have read something about whole deal with citizenship of Russia. I think it is their way to combat demographic decline. If I am not wrong everyone who has Soviet Union birth certificate can get Russian citizenship, so I could get it :D Recently Russia and Belorus are having some kind of negotiations about further integration. Not sure if anything will come of this Lukashenko will not agree to become second rate player.
 
Dec 2017
474
Australia
#27
I have read something about whole deal with citizenship of Russia. I think it is their way to combat demographic decline. If I am not wrong everyone who has Soviet Union birth certificate can get Russian citizenship, so I could get it :D Recently Russia and Belorus are having some kind of negotiations about further integration. Not sure if anything will come of this Lukashenko will not agree to become second rate player.
Russia pressures Belarus for further integrations. Belarus doesn't have Russian military base to these days. Belarus looks towards Lithuania and Poland. Lithuania pressures Belarus because of Nuclear Power Plant in Ostrovets. This is the latest nuclear power post Fukushima. There's a nuclear plant near Zagreb. You've had Ignalina (Chernobyl like) power plant near Daugavpils.

If you push Belarus, then it will become part of Russia. Don't you see this? I think Polish, especially Lithuanian government are dumb.