Are Brahmins Jews?

Aupmanyav

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,298
New Delhi, India
#51
What else a Pakistani Warrior would say? I associate Qajar tribe with Gujars. As for Indo-Iranin Aryans, I believe they travelled from Yamanaya region to Oxus, to Sogdiana, Mery, Balkh, Bala Murghab valley, to Tezdin/Hari-Rud Valley. The forum rules, however, do not permit us to discuss genetics here. RSS has people from all sections of Indian society. South India is well-represented by the Indian Vice President, Mr. Venkaiah Naidu.
 
Apr 2018
439
India
#52
What else a Pakistani Warrior would say? I associate Qajar tribe with Gujars. As for Indo-Iranin Aryans, I believe they travelled from Yamanaya region to Oxus, to Sogdiana, Mery, Balkh, Bala Murghab valley, to Tezdin/Hari-Rud Valley. The forum rules, however, do not permit us to discuss genetics here. RSS has people from all sections of Indian society. South India is well-represented by the Indian Vice President, Mr. Venkaiah Naidu.
Not Qajar. He is talking about Khazars and making an entertaining attempt to make the Ashkenazi-Khazar hypothesis applicable to Brahmins.
 

Aupmanyav

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,298
New Delhi, India
#53
Any different? Wikipedia:

The Qajars (also spelled Kadjars, Kajars, Kadzhars, Cadzhars, Cadjars and so on) are a Turkic Oghuz tribe who lived variously, with other tribes, in the area that is now Armenia, Azerbaijan and northwestern Iran.

The Khazars (/ˈkɑːzɑːrz/, /ˈxɑː-/; Hebrew: כוזרים‎, Kuzarim;[9] Persian: خزر‎; Turkish: Hazarlar; Azerbaijani: Xəzərlər; Bashkir: Хазарлар; Tatar: Хәзәрләр, Xäzärlär; Xazar; Ukrainian: Хоза́ри, Khozáry; Russian: Хаза́ры, Khazáry; Hungarian: Kazárok; Greek: Χάζαροι, Házaroi; Latin: Gazari[10][11]/Gasani[12][13]) were a semi-nomadic Turkic people with a confederation of Turkic-speaking tribes that in the late 6th century CE established a major commercial empire covering the southeastern section of modern European Russia.
 
Apr 2018
439
India
#54
Any different? Wikipedia:

The Qajars (also spelled Kadjars, Kajars, Kadzhars, Cadzhars, Cadjars and so on) are a Turkic Oghuz tribe who lived variously, with other tribes, in the area that is now Armenia, Azerbaijan and northwestern Iran.

The Khazars (/ˈkɑːzɑːrz/, /ˈxɑː-/; Hebrew: כוזרים‎, Kuzarim;[9] Persian: خزر‎; Turkish: Hazarlar; Azerbaijani: Xəzərlər; Bashkir: Хазарлар; Tatar: Хәзәрләр, Xäzärlär; Xazar; Ukrainian: Хоза́ри, Khozáry; Russian: Хаза́ры, Khazáry; Hungarian: Kazárok; Greek: Χάζαροι, Házaroi; Latin: Gazari[10][11]/Gasani[12][13]) were a semi-nomadic Turkic people with a confederation of Turkic-speaking tribes that in the late 6th century CE established a major commercial empire covering the southeastern section of modern European Russia.
Actually yes. You see the Khazars actually ruled what is now Ukraine from around 650-980. Judaism was their state religion. Repeated onslaught by the Rus' and Alans devastated the empire (like Tallikota). Khazaria would never regain even a fraction of their earlier prominence. No trace of their continued existence is found post Rus'-Mongol conflicts in the 13th century. It is hypothesized, mostly without any proof and based on logical fallacies and dubious pseudoscientific means, that Ashkenazi Jews of Eastern Europe (majority of Israeli population) are actually descendants of the Khazars. This is one attempt to nullify Israel's claim on Mandatory Palestine by proving (laughably) them Eastern Europeans (You see Khazars were converted). Hardline Israelis have an equally stupid genetic counter-claim but that's irrelevant here.

On the other hand, although the distant ancestors of Persian Qajars (1790s-1920s) were Oghuz Turks and their empire in Kazakhstan bordered Khazaria, these were not the same people. And the Oghuz were mostly muslims while Khazars were Jews.

However, if you can prove that Qajars actually descended from Khazars, President's Medal of Israel is 100% pakka. Do throw a party and remember to invite. :winktongue:
 

Aupmanyav

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,298
New Delhi, India
#55
Neither the Qajars nor the Khazars (if the two wee different) were originally Jew or Muslim. They may have become that at a later time. I have not read the two articles thoroughly (which I will do now), but probably their beliefs were similar to IE people who lived and spread from the Eurasian steppes - the Kurgan and Andronovo cultures, in later times, the Magis and Zoroastrians.
 

Aatreya

Ad Honorem
Dec 2014
3,464
USA
#56
येभिः शिवः स्ववानेवयावभिर्दिवःसिषक्ति स्वयशा निकामभिः ll
yebhiḥ śivaḥ svavānevayāvabhirdivaḥsiṣakti svayaśā nikāmabhiḥ ||
With whom, the Eager Ones, going their ordered course, he comes from heaven Self-bright, auspicious, strong to guard.
Rig Veda: Rig-Veda, Book 10: HYMN XCII. Viśvedevas.

:) That is the only reference to such an important God as Shiva in ten books of RigVeda, 1028 hymns, 10,600 verses, and that too in the sense of 'auspicious', and not as Shiva the God. The God about whom they are talking is an Aryan one, Rudra*.

"This god (Rudra) occupies a subordinate position in the RV, being celebrated in only three entire hymns, in part of another, and in one conjointly with Soma. .. His color is reddish (Babhru, Bhura); his form is dazzling, for he shines like the radiant sun, like gold. He is arrayed with golden ornaments, and wears a glorious necklace (niská). He drives in a car (Chariot). His weapons are often referred to: he holds the thunderbolt in his arm, and discharges his lightning shaft from the sky; but he is usually said to be armed with a bow and arrows, which are strong and swift."
A Vedic Reader (Excerpts)

Do you think that the description matches with Shiva? The conclusion is that Aryans and RigVeda do not mention Shiva who is an indigenous God of Hindus. Ariaca, you have much to learn. :)
You need to first learn how to read and split words. The rest will follow.
 

Aatreya

Ad Honorem
Dec 2014
3,464
USA
#57
Did not the two Gods merge in the fashion of another minor Vedic God, Vishnu, with just 6 hymns to his name, who merged with the indigenous Gods, Rama, Krishna and others? And did not Sarswati merge with the indigenous Hindu Mother Goddess Durga? Your sense of history is upside down. In Hindi, we term it as 'Ulatvasi', in the fashion of Goddess Alakshmi. You would always take the opposite meaning from what the whole world accepts.
World? Whose world? I concur with the world of Hindus, the originators of these deities and the sublime thought behind those deities. We know who you concur with, and their views are not accepted as authentic. Move on.
 

Aatreya

Ad Honorem
Dec 2014
3,464
USA
#58
No. Shiva is not mentioned in RigVeda. There is no hymn dedicated to him or any other indigenous God or Goddess. The word was used in the sense of 'auspicious'. Shiva was known to the indigenous with many other names like Mahadeva. There is a particular Telugu word for Shiva which I do not remember now.After the indigenous picked up Sanskrit, Shiva became his name.

It seems that the indigenous were not against the minor Vedic Gods. Both Vishnu and Rudra were minor Vedic Gods. Their ire was against Indra in particular and yajnas. That is why Shiv's destruction of Daksha's yajna, or the defeat of Indra by Krishna or the branding of Indra as an adulterer after which worship of Indra was banned in India, except when yajna's were conducted.

Movement of IE people and its effects on mythology of countries right from Ireland to India is well-established by mythology, archaeology, history and linguistics. But our chauvinist friends here would not accept it. There is hardly anything Vedic in Hinduism as practiced today. There was fire worship in every household five times a day (Garhpatyagni) which was to be continued from the time of one's marriage till the death of one person in the couple. There were hundreds of kinds of yajnas. Do we do that now except and occasional homa in homes once or twice in a year? The Vedic religion became just small part of Hinduism. It is wrong to say that Hinduism derives from Vedas. It is just a lip service to the merged culture. I am not against that, they are surely a part of us. Hinduism is the religion of the indigenous majority which Aryans accepted with their merger in Indian population. All migrants and invaders did that before the advent of Islam. Greeks, Parthians, Pahalavas, Scythians, Kushanas, Hunas, Tibeto-Burmans and many more, all merged in the hindu society.
Agree that you have no clue.
 
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