Caste System in India - History & Annihilation

Aupmanyav

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,491
New Delhi, India
Does not mean much. They have been in India for upward of 3,000 years and have mixed freely with indigenous people. Of course, their influence remains on Indian languages and Hinduism. Vedic religion now is a part of Hinduism (though its importance is overblown). How about this:

 
Oct 2015
1,061
India
In today context the word "Aryan' is meaningless in India in racial or genetic sense. However, people to tend to loosely say that white-skinned people from northern India are descendents of "Aryans". That is not true.

White skinned people:

First set of arrivals: Rig Vedic Aryans were a small group of 'white-skinned' people who migrated into India somewhere around 1900 BCE. They spoke a language similar to Sanskrit.

Later sets of arrivals: After Rig Vedic people, several people migrated into India from West Asia and Central Asia over centuries. All of them were 'white-skinned'. So for example,

  1. Persians came around 450 BCE from Iran ruled parts of Pakistan.
  2. Indo-Scythians came in c. 150 BCE from Central Asia via Afghanistan and ruled Pakistan and parts of Western India.
  3. Kushans came from Central Asia and ruled Pakistan and large part of North India.
  4. Indo-Hephthalites came in c. 450 CE and ruled in Pakistan and some parts of India.
They all became mixed with Indians and lost their original separate identities.

Brown & Dark skinned people:

Now all the above "Aryans" meaning "white skinned" people have inter-married and mixed up with local people from 1900 BCE onwards. Such marriages became less frequent once caste system became rigid around c. 320 CE, but have continued in various friendly ways.

To summarize, India has a high proportion of people speaking "Aryan languages" but this linguistic-group does not consist racially of original "Aryans". If you force me to put ball-point numbers, then in the Indo-Aryan linguistic group; 25% may be the "white-skinned" sets described above. It may be further divided as 05% from first set and 10% from later sets.
 
Feb 2019
2
Bangkok
Future is in our hands. I am now an non-denomination Hindu. I propose all Hindus change their ancestral surnames to new surnames, from their respective languages. For example my ancestral name is Pandey, gupta, etc. I change to new surname - Bharatwasi. With passage of time caste will be history.
1) Unanimously Create a World Hindu Authority
2) The Authority issues decrees to abolish caste system
3) All Hindus hv to shed their ancestral surnames and adopt new one based on their respective languages.
4) Create an online database
5) Each family arranges a meeting to pick a surname and registers with the registrar. (Cannot use all earlier surnames).
6) Surnames are thus somewhat patented, only a member of family can use the particular surname.
7) The Authority abolishes all caste based marriages. Kundlis and Patras are done away with.
 

Aupmanyav

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,491
New Delhi, India
Congratulations for your excellent suggestions. However, I do not think Indians are going to leave their caste names but they would become unimportant. You would need to have some foreign agency to keep the records of new surnames because if you delegate this to us, we will make a hash of it. Perhaps we should approach Google, FB or Twitter. Do you mean that all caste based marriages will be null and void and the persons will have to marry again? I do agree with you that kundlies and patras unscientific superstitions and they should be abolished. So also the untested unstandardized Ayurvedic medicines.
 

Aatreya

Ad Honorem
Dec 2014
3,524
USA
In today context the word "Aryan' is meaningless in India in racial or genetic sense. However, people to tend to loosely say that white-skinned people from northern India are descendents of "Aryans". That is not true.

White skinned people:

First set of arrivals: Rig Vedic Aryans were a small group of 'white-skinned' people who migrated into India somewhere around 1900 BCE. They spoke a language similar to Sanskrit.

Later sets of arrivals: After Rig Vedic people, several people migrated into India from West Asia and Central Asia over centuries. All of them were 'white-skinned'. So for example,

  1. Persians came around 450 BCE from Iran ruled parts of Pakistan.
  2. Indo-Scythians came in c. 150 BCE from Central Asia via Afghanistan and ruled Pakistan and parts of Western India.
  3. Kushans came from Central Asia and ruled Pakistan and large part of North India.
  4. Indo-Hephthalites came in c. 450 CE and ruled in Pakistan and some parts of India.
They all became mixed with Indians and lost their original separate identities.

Brown & Dark skinned people:

Now all the above "Aryans" meaning "white skinned" people have inter-married and mixed up with local people from 1900 BCE onwards. Such marriages became less frequent once caste system became rigid around c. 320 CE, but have continued in various friendly ways.

To summarize, India has a high proportion of people speaking "Aryan languages" but this linguistic-group does not consist racially of original "Aryans". If you force me to put ball-point numbers, then in the Indo-Aryan linguistic group; 25% may be the "white-skinned" sets described above. It may be further divided as 05% from first set and 10% from later sets.
"Rig Vedic Aryans were a small group of white skinned people". This is the most unscientific baloney I have ever heard.

Get over it, there is no such thing like white skinned Rig Vedic Aryans.
 
Likes: prashanth
Feb 2019
2
Bangkok
Congratulations for your excellent suggestions. However, I do not think Indians are going to leave their caste names but they would become unimportant. You would need to have some foreign agency to keep the records of new surnames because if you delegate this to us, we will make a hash of it. Perhaps we should approach Google, FB or Twitter. Do you mean that all caste based marriages will be null and void and the persons will have to marry again? I do agree with you that kundlies and patras unscientific superstitions and they should be abolished. So also the untested unstandardized Ayurvedic medicines.
Laws are not supposed to be Retrospective, hence no remarriage. The Veds, Purans existing are not the last ones, a Rishi can always author a new one. How to do can always be discussed later, first intention and will to do must be created.
 
Oct 2015
1,061
India
Future is in our hands. I am now an non-denomination Hindu. I propose all Hindus change their ancestral surnames to new surnames, from their respective languages. For example my ancestral name is Pandey, gupta, etc. I change to new surname - Bharatwasi. With passage of time caste will be history.
1) Unanimously Create a World Hindu Authority
2) The Authority issues decrees to abolish caste system
3) All Hindus hv to shed their ancestral surnames and adopt new one based on their respective languages.
4) Create an online database
5) Each family arranges a meeting to pick a surname and registers with the registrar. (Cannot use all earlier surnames).
6) Surnames are thus somewhat patented, only a member of family can use the particular surname.
7) The Authority abolishes all caste based marriages. Kundlis and Patras are done away with.
Nice you choose the name 'Bharat-wasi' though you are 'Thailand-wasi' now. I visited Thailand some years back. My impression was that culturally it is India, no different. Their open attitudes to sex also seemed like typically Indian, like they must have been in India before Islamic and/or British occupation brought guilt around it and degraded the women engaged. (Of course, today what exists in Thailand is dollar exploitation of young women by old men and is not okay).

As regards caste, some people do change their caste-names and I have met such in my family and outside. One does not need to register, only enter in school record at time of first admission.

We need to have many more such ideas.
 
Likes: prashanth

Similar History Discussions