China in crisis?

Apr 2013
6,065
China
i don't understand the adj. word "western" for "a more western outlook"
trading and marketing have already been discussed by sima qian the historian of china over 2000 years ago.
deng proposed and pushed "reform and open". "reform" is for changing planned economy into market economy, changing the whole state management to adopting unknown future. the market economy is not binded with west. the ongoing reforming state management is obviously a chinese brand, which is not similar to western ones.
the "open" is for opening of foreign investment, opening of communications and cooperations. this is also not a "western" binded idea.

days ago, i hear a speech from an important person of the States that chinese progress is due to western, specifically US guidance. that is very ugly opinion.
same here, the "western" outlook
 
Oct 2013
4,364
Canada
Is this not an unfair comparison given the metric and means used for a higher standard of living had to be first developed, in the west itself before being adopted and adapted by others?

What do you consider to be the standards of a higher standard of living ?

China has been progressing for thousands of years, with some blips which are to be expected given the time frame. No need to start/stop China's development to a specific year, as this is largely irrivelent and could be argued to be apoint where progression stopped, until perhaps Deng Xiaoping....when a more western outlook and economy began to be adopted.
"Blips."

What's a blip? Just because China was virile enough to survive world-killing crises does not belittle events to "blips."
 
Oct 2013
4,364
Canada
i don't understand the adj. word "western" for "a more western outlook"
trading and marketing have already been discussed by sima qian the historian of china over 2000 years ago.
deng proposed and pushed "reform and open". "reform" is for changing planned economy into market economy, changing the whole state management to adopting unknown future. the market economy is not binded with west. the ongoing reforming state management is obviously a chinese brand, which is not similar to western ones.
the "open" is for opening of foreign investment, opening of communications and cooperations. this is also not a "western" binded idea.

days ago, i hear a speech from an important person of the States that chinese progress is due to western, specifically US guidance. that is very ugly opinion.
same here, the "western" outlook
But wait... You are Chinese, you are only disagreeing with a Westerner because you are brainwashed.

/sarcasm
 
Aug 2009
5,033
Londinium
"Blips."

What's a blip? Just because China was virile enough to survive world-killing crises does not belittle events to "blips."
Ok, if me you and other posters are going to talk about China, again, we're going to have to calm down and not take every post as some attack on Chinese people or even the Chinese Civ.

Blips mean a object or event outside of the trajectory or whats to be expected i.e. China/Chinese civ has been constantly advancing and developing, aside from a few blips (civil wars etc). I'm not belittling anything as this is also applicable to other nations/peoples etc.
 
Aug 2009
5,033
Londinium
i don't understand the adj. word "western" for "a more western outlook"
trading and marketing have already been discussed by sima qian the historian of china over 2000 years ago.
deng proposed and pushed "reform and open". "reform" is for changing planned economy into market economy, changing the whole state management to adopting unknown future. the market economy is not binded with west. the ongoing reforming state management is obviously a chinese brand, which is not similar to western ones.
the "open" is for opening of foreign investment, opening of communications and cooperations. this is also not a "western" binded idea.

days ago, i hear a speech from an important person of the States that chinese progress is due to western, specifically US guidance. that is very ugly opinion.
same here, the "western" outlook
I asked the previous poster to explain what he meant by "developed". I think this explanation will help focus the conversation and also clarifying his/her points.
 
Dec 2015
4,042
Brassicaland
  • VHS

    VHS

Is this not an unfair comparison given the metric and means used for a higher standard of living had to be first developed, in the west itself before being adopted and adapted by others?

What do you consider to be the standards of a higher standard of living ?

China has been progressing for thousands of years, with some blips which are to be expected given the time frame. No need to start/stop China's development to a specific year, as this is largely irrivelent and could be argued to be apoint where progression stopped, until perhaps Deng Xiaoping....when a more western outlook and economy began to be adopted.
We often define "higher standards of living" with these parameters:
The size of living space (Hong Kong would be quite dismal by this parameter.)
Public transportation and its efficiency
Availability of goods and services
Availability of modern amenities such as the Internet

Even in developed countries, we have relatively underdeveloped parts.
 
Aug 2009
5,033
Londinium
We often define "higher standards of living" with these parameters:
The size of living space (Hong Kong would be quite dismal by this parameter.)
Public transportation and its efficiency
Availability of goods and services
Availability of modern amenities such as the Internet

Even in developed countries, we have relatively underdeveloped parts.
The last part in indisputable, there are areas of extreme poverty in even the richest nations, even the most prosperous cities, within themselves, have poverty and areas falling behind the rest.

I’ve never heard of those definitions of standard of living before, aside from availability of goods and services, where did you get these from, or are they your own? Just wondering who the “we” you refer to is.

Lets say someone wants to emigrate, start a new life and can choose any country they want. What someone would look for? What would allow them to live a full life as their talent allows or what society would be best suited to their goals and overall wellbeing. I think it’s self-evident that any nation that can tick off as many of the below would be in that category.

A standard of living is the level of wealth, comfort, material goods and necessities available to a certain socioeconomic class or a certain geographic area. The standard of living includes factors such as income, gross domestic product (GDP), national economic growth, economic and political stability, political and religious freedom, environmental quality, climate and safety. The standard of living is closely related to quality of life.
Standard of Living

Then there’s the standard of living Vs quality of life debate. Personally, I think the quality of life is a better metric:
• freedom from slavery and torture
• equal protection of the law
• freedom from discrimination
• freedom of movement
• freedom of residence within one's home country
• presumption of innocence unless proved guilty
• right to marry
• right to have a family
• right to be treated equally without regard to gender, race, language, religion, political beliefs, nationality, socioeconomic status and more
• right to privacy
• freedom of thought
• freedom of religion
• free choice of employment
• right to fair pay
• equal pay for equal work
• right to vote
• right to rest and leisure
• right to education
• right to human dignity
Standard of Living Vs. Quality of Life

Standard of living - Wikipedia
 
Apr 2013
6,065
China
The last part in indisputable, there are areas of extreme poverty in even the richest nations, even the most prosperous cities, within themselves, have poverty and areas falling behind the rest.

I’ve never heard of those definitions of standard of living before, aside from availability of goods and services, where did you get these from, or are they your own? Just wondering who the “we” you refer to is.

Lets say someone wants to emigrate, start a new life and can choose any country they want. What someone would look for? What would allow them to live a full life as their talent allows or what society would be best suited to their goals and overall wellbeing. I think it’s self-evident that any nation that can tick off as many of the below would be in that category.


Standard of Living

Then there’s the standard of living Vs quality of life debate. Personally, I think the quality of life is a better metric:

Standard of Living Vs. Quality of Life

Standard of living - Wikipedia
i have no exact opinion on living standard.

but must say...in fact... one could use the same pattern here to refute anyone:

------------------------------------------
where you get the standard list from?
here is a better standard, or even a better metric:
...
...

------------------------------------------

our english poster friends did not realize it is indeed a subjective topic of living standard/life quality, while some english sources do not reflect the complexity of human, because many people of the planet do not share the language.
 
Aug 2009
5,033
Londinium
i have no exact opinion on living standard.

but must say...in fact... one could use the same pattern here to refute anyone:

------------------------------------------

where you get the standard list from?

here is a better standard, or even a better metric:
LOL You just described a conversation!

What would you prefer, here is the definition of standard of living, that is now *your* definition of standard of living?


our english poster friends did not realize it is indeed a subjective topic of living standard/life quality, while some english sources do not reflect the complexity of human, because many people of the planet do not share the language.
Language differences are no factor in this discussion, so long as we can read each other’s points.
 
Apr 2013
6,065
China
LOL You just described a conversation!

What would you prefer, here is the definition of standard of living, that is now *your* definition of standard of living?




Language differences are no factor in this discussion, so long as we can read each other’s points.
it is very apparent, the point is not on language. language is only a feature that marks people's difference.
 

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