Confederate flag flown in WWII!

Viperlord

Ad Honorem
Aug 2010
8,101
VA
#32
Yes I am and I'm also asking that you people need to learn to stay on topic instead of deflecting the issue.
So to be absolutely clear, you're asking me to provide a historical source proving that another poster's post on an Internet forum from three days ago wasn't meant literally, after I replied to your snide remark on said post by pointing out that it probably wasn't meant seriously, which you seemed to have overlooked.


... And you're now claiming that it's others who are off-topic, after demanding historical sources on whether or not a probable joke post was serious? Okay, this has been an interesting exercise in reading comprehension and self-awareness.
 
Likes: sailorsam

royal744

Ad Honoris
Jul 2013
10,153
San Antonio, Tx
#33
Objectively or in their own minds? I think the Lost Cause was a major source of pride for the South - I think it still is. The fact that it's a case of revisionist history doesn't matter to the layman. To them, they're carrying on the Jeffersonian cause and weeding out corruption as it threatens to choke off the "true intentions" of the Founding Fathers.

Overall, though, I think the South considered itself pure, cocooned in tradition, much like English nationalists of the time did. The works of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle and GK Chesterton come to mind when I think about Southern pride, to be honest. That probably sounds like an odd comparison, but I could make a decent Southern parody out of The Ballad of the White Horse if I changed a few lines. That traditionalism was in stark contrast with the North and out of it was born a sense of regional superiority.
There isn’t any real evidence that the majority of southern voters actually supported Secession. There was so much skullduggery and cheating going on that I am deeply suspicious of the so-called results.
 

royal744

Ad Honoris
Jul 2013
10,153
San Antonio, Tx
#34
If the captain had been a Texan, the Lone Star probably would have gone up over Shuri Castle instead of the Stars & Bars!

Because Texas entered the Union as a republic, I believe that it's the only state flag that can be flown at the same level as the Stars & Stripes - not below it.
Wrong.
 
#36
There isn’t any real evidence that the majority of southern voters actually supported Secession. There was so much skullduggery and cheating going on that I am deeply suspicious of the so-called results.
As far as secession goes, I agree that the support it received wasn't anywhere near unanimous. Even the records of the voting results show just how close it was in many cases. I don't think Unionism is a contradiction in terms of Southern pride or tradition, though. When I spoke of the tradition that is tended in the South, I didn't mean Confederate tradition and all the unpatriotic sentiments that it entails. I meant Jeffersonian tradition, in which the South's heritage has its political and economic roots. That tradition is most notably observed in the Lost Cause movement, although the Civil War itself had little to do with it. That's why the Battle Flag (more closely associated with the Lost Cause than the Civil War) is the symbol of Southern pride rather than the true Confederate flag. The regional contrast is not secessionism versus Unionism; it's Jeffersonian ideology versus Hamiltonian.
 
Oct 2017
112
United States
#37
Obviously since the civil rights movement the confederate flag has come to be negatively associated with support for slavery & racism, but was it perceived similarly before that like when it was flown that day on May 21, 1945 at the battle of Okinawa? So how would they have perceived the conefederate flag?

My understanding is that before the civil rights movement, the civil war was perceived in terms of states rights’ & emancipation was just viewed as a side effect & unimportant.

Also keep in mind that there were still some civil war veterans & former slaves alive back then.
 
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Viperlord

Ad Honorem
Aug 2010
8,101
VA
#38
Obviously since the civil rights movement the confederate flag has come to be negatively associated with support for slavery & racism, but was it perceived similarly before that like when it was flown that day on May 21, 1945 at the battle of Okinawa? So how would they have perceived the conefederate flag?

My understanding is that before the civil rights movement, the civil war was perceived in terms of states rights’ & emancipation was just viewed as a side effect & unimportant.

Also keep in mind that there were still some civil war veterans & former slaves alive back then.
It was perceived as a white supremacist symbol by the same people who came up with it. From William Thompson, creator of the 2nd National Confederate Flag.



“As a people we are fighting to maintain the Heaven-ordained supremacy of the white man over the inferior or colored race; a white flag would thus be emblematical of our cause… we still think the battle flag on a pure white field would be more appropriate and handsome. Such a flag would be a suitable emblem of our young confederacy, and sustained by the brave hearts and strong arms of the south, it would soon take rank among the proudest ensigns of the nations, and be hailed by the civilized world as THE WHITE MAN’S FLAG… As a national emblem it is significant of our higher cause the cause of a superior race, and a higher civilization contending against ignorance, infidelity and barbarism.”
 

royal744

Ad Honoris
Jul 2013
10,153
San Antonio, Tx
#39
Obviously since the civil rights movement the confederate flag has come to be negatively associated with support for slavery & racism, but was it perceived similarly before that like when it was flown that day on May 21, 1945 at the battle of Okinawa? So how would they have perceived the conefederate flag?

My understanding is that before the civil rights movement, the civil war was perceived in terms of states rights’ & emancipation was just viewed as a side effect & unimportant.

Also keep in mind that there were still some civil war veterans & former slaves alive back then.
For the South it was about slavery; for the North, it was about preserving the Union.
 

royal744

Ad Honoris
Jul 2013
10,153
San Antonio, Tx
#40
My understanding is that before the civil rights movement, the civil war was perceived in terms of states rights’ & emancipation was just viewed as a side effect & unimportant.
Your understanding is incorrect. It was about racism and white supremacy. Drop the blinders, please.
 

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