Did Mary I and Elizabeth I hate Henry VIII?

Jan 2019
220
London, United Kingdom
#61
Again I don't know where in the Bible I can find the relevant text, but I am pretty sure adultery is condemned in the Bible and by the Church. So even judging by the standards in Henry VIII's times, he was a very immoral person.
 
Aug 2015
2,359
uk
#63
I very much doubt that Henry saw himself as equal to any person on Earth. The thing with the Bible is that it is so big and wide ranging, with texts from various authors that you can pick passages that pretty much agree with anything you want them to - as Henry and Anne did when divorcing Catherine.
 
Jan 2019
220
London, United Kingdom
#64
I very much doubt that Henry saw himself as equal to any person on Earth. The thing with the Bible is that it is so big and wide ranging, with texts from various authors that you can pick passages that pretty much agree with anything you want them to - as Henry and Anne did when divorcing Catherine.
Yeah totally agree. That's why reading the Bible is such a big headache for me. However, with regard to adultery, I think it is very unlikely any text in the Bible encourages adultery.
 
Aug 2015
2,359
uk
#66
Again I don't know where in the Bible I can find the relevant text, but I am pretty sure adultery is condemned in the Bible and by the Church. So even judging by the standards in Henry VIII's times, he was a very immoral person.

Relationships with mistresses were not seen as adultery. They were an important part of the king showing his virility and kingliness. Also when courting when Anne , he did not consider himself as being truly married because she (Catherine) had been his brother's wife.
 
Aug 2014
4,466
Australia
#67
Again I don't know where in the Bible I can find the relevant text, but I am pretty sure adultery is condemned in the Bible and by the Church. So even judging by the standards in Henry VIII's times, he was a very immoral person.
A ruler had to ignore questions of morality and do what is best for the kingdom. It was unsustainable for a ruler to act morally at all times because these actions may bear negative consequences for the state as a whole.

What was best for England was for Henry to have a male heir and this was his primary goal in all his actions. Everything Henry did needs to be seen from this perspective.
 
Last edited:
Jan 2019
220
London, United Kingdom
#68
There was no such thing as an immoral sovereign. A ruler had to ignore questions of morality and do what is best for the kingdom. It is simply unsustainable for a ruler to exclusively pursue a path of morally “good” actions and decisions, as they may bear negative consequences for the state as a whole.

What was best for England was for Henry to have a male heir and this was his primary goal in all his relationships . Everything Henry did needs to be seen from this perspective.
I don't think a monarch could disregard morality. In doing so he set a very bad example for his subjects. Everyone would say "If the king can do this, why can't I"?
 
Aug 2014
4,466
Australia
#69
I don't think a monarch could disregard morality. In doing so he set a very bad example for his subjects. Everyone would say "If the king can do this, why can't I"?
Because the King is responsible for the wellbeing of his subjects. If he could execute one innocent person in order to stop a war that would kill thousands, do you think he should do it?
 
Jan 2019
220
London, United Kingdom
#70
Relationships with mistresses were not seen as adultery. They were an important part of the king showing his virility and kingliness. Also when courting when Anne , he did not consider himself as being truly married because she (Catherine) had been his brother's wife.
An interesting perspective. Never thought about it in this way. However, it's likely that he also had girlfriends when he considered himself legally married. In TV show "The Tudors" he had extra-marital sex with a lady in waiting while Jane Seymour was pregnant. I know TV show is not historically accurate, but I think it is very likely that he did so.
 

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