Difference between nationalism and patriotism?

Aug 2014
3,700
Australia
#21
I call myself a patriot, but not a nationalist.
Nobody thinks of themselves as a nationalist. Just like nobody thinks of themselves as a fascist. People can get into meaningless semantics about the difference between "nation" and "country" but it is all bollocks. Everyone is a patriot. Nationalism is just an extreme form of patriotism.
 
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Tulius

Ad Honorem
May 2016
4,623
Portugal
#22
Nobody thinks of themselves as a nationalist. Just like nobody thinks of themselves as a fascist. People can get into meaningless semantics about the difference between "nation" and "country" but it is all bollocks. Everyone is a patriot. Nationalism is just an extreme form of patriotism.
Personally I consider myself both.

The usual definition of patriotism is the link to a country; while the definition of nationalism is the link to a nation.

Since not all the states of the world are nation-states, one person can be a nationalist without being a patriot. So it is much more than semantics. Even if semantics often are relevant in Human and Social Sciences. But it is mostly a question of intelligibility.
 

Ficino

Ad Honorem
Apr 2012
6,764
Romania
#24
Personally I consider myself both.

The usual definition of patriotism is the link to a country; while the definition of nationalism is the link to a nation.

Since not all the states of the world are nation-states, one person can be a nationalist without being a patriot. So it is much more than semantics. Even if semantics often are relevant in Human and Social Sciences. But it is mostly a question of intelligibility.
I consider myself both too. If you take just the example of Romania, the emergence of national consciousness among Romanians predates the establishment of the Romanian State, it was the Romanian nationalist movement that led to the establishment of the Romanian State and not vice versa.
 

Tulius

Ad Honorem
May 2016
4,623
Portugal
#26
The only difference is one of degree. Semantic arguments about the difference between a nation and a country are irrelevant.
Today it begun a trail of some Catalan Nationalists. There is no Catalan state, so under the given definition they can’t be Catalan Patriots. They are Spanish citizens and surely they are not Spanish Patriots. In other words, they are Nationalists but they aren't Patriots.

Is this just semantics? Is this only a difference in degree between nation and state? Between nationalism and patriotism?
 
Oct 2015
4,693
Matosinhos Portugal
#27
Friend Tulius the Catalans with I have spoken over the years, everyone tells me they are not Spanish. I am always told I am Catalan I am not Spanish. You have an example on the .Francisco Fortes Calvo that was manager of the club Farense


With all my respect I say. On the Catalan and Basque languages for us Portuguese is equal to the Chinés we do not count anything, as vice versa.
Only the Galician language is what we understand even though it has a lot of Castilians that helps us understand less and less.

In my opinion Spain is a union of countries with several different languages, it is similar to England.

(They are united kingdoms, with their differences.)

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Amigo Tulius os catalães com eu falei ao longo dos anos, todo eles me dizem que não são espanhóis. Sempre me disseram que sou catalão e não espanhol. Você tem um exemplo .Francisco Fortes Calvo que foi treinador do clube Farense.


Com todo o meu respeito digo.Sobre as linguas Catalã e Basca para nós portuguêses é igual ao Chinés não entedemos nada,como vice versa.
Só a lingua Galega é que entendemos mesmo assim tem muita mistura de castelhano que nos ajuda a entender cada vez menos.


Na minha opinião a Espanha é uma união de países com várias linguas diferentes,é similar á Inglaterra ( São reinos unidos,com as suas diferenças. )
 
Feb 2019
8
Turtle Island
#28
I think "patriotism" implies rebellion. But in the context of just love for one's country, there is no difference really. Nationalism simply asserts the existence of a national identity. It can be left or right wing, revolutionary or reactionary, colonial or anti-colonial, etc. but at the end of the day, if you assert the existence of a nationality which you identify yourself as belonging to, then you are a nationalist by definition. If you prefer "patriot", fine, but they fundamentally mean the same thing in this context.
 
May 2013
1,615
The abode of the lord of the north
#29
I think "patriotism" implies rebellion. But in the context of just love for one's country, there is no difference really. Nationalism simply asserts the existence of a national identity. It can be left or right wing, revolutionary or reactionary, colonial or anti-colonial, etc. but at the end of the day, if you assert the existence of a nationality which you identify yourself as belonging to, then you are a nationalist by definition. If you prefer "patriot", fine, but they fundamentally mean the same thing in this context.
Patriots can exist in independent, democratic, republic countries too. Patriots consider they have an inbound duty to their country. Nationalists take a further step and considers every other countries and countrymen to be inferior to theirs.

In a nutshell, Nationalism is Patriotism plus some fanaticism.
 

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