Discovery of Australia

Oct 2015
5,179
Matosinhos Portugal
#41
LatinoEuropa said:
@Dan Howard OK

TERRA DE JAVA . Cristóvão Mendonça 1522 ) AUSTRALIA

Discovery of the Timor 1512 portuguese Timor It is close to Australia
Really? You think a distance of over 2000 km is "close"?

Look, it is good to keep an open mind, but not so open that your brain falls out. Australians have been studying this subject pretty thoroughly for over a century. We would love to see some proper evidence that sheds more light on this part of our history.

________________________________________

LatinoEuropa said:
@Dan Howard OK

TERRA DE JAVA . Cristóvão Mendonça 1522 ) AUSTRALIA

Discovery of the Timor 1512 portuguese Timor It is close to Australia
Really? You think a distance of over 2000 km is "close"?

Look, it is good to keep an open mind, but not so open that your brain falls out. Australians have been studying this subject pretty thoroughly for over a century. We would love to see some proper evidence that sheds more light on this part of our history.

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Yes, it's near.

Similar City Porto Londom 2030 km
 

Tulius

Ad Honorem
May 2016
5,369
Portugal
#43
The Vikings were the first explorers of the New World, and the first ones who settled there. It makes a difference.

So that really closes the question about America.
Once a historian wrote something like this: many people passed the Rubicon, but the only relevant one in historical terms was the passing of the Rubicon by Julius Caesar.

It is a bit like the arrival to America. Many people arrived or could have arrived there but the one that has historical relevance is not the arrival of the Norseman (not necessarily Vikings), but the arrival of the Spanish, with the first voyage of Cristobal Colon. That was the voyage that linked Europe with America, not the arrival of the Norsemen or the potential arrival of a good number of pseudo candidates more or less likely.

Following the same reasoning, about Australia, it was not the probable arrival of the Portuguese, Spanish or Chinese there. It was its “discovery” to the Europeans by the Dutch and the later colonization by the British that joined Australia to the rest of the known world.
 
Likes: Teslatron
Feb 2015
111
south Slavic guy
#44
Once a historian wrote something like this: many people passed the Rubicon, but the only relevant one in historical terms was the passing of the Rubicon by Julius Caesar.

It is a bit like the arrival to America. Many people arrived or could have arrived there but the one that has historical relevance is not the arrival of the Norseman (not necessarily Vikings), but the arrival of the Spanish, with the first voyage of Cristobal Colon. That was the voyage that linked Europe with America, not the arrival of the Norsemen or the potential arrival of a good number of pseudo candidates more or less likely.

Following the same reasoning, about Australia, it was not the probable arrival of the Portuguese, Spanish or Chinese there. It was its “discovery” to the Europeans by the Dutch and the later colonization by the British that joined Australia to the rest of the known world.
And why should the later discovery by Cristobal? who be more imporatant than that of the Vikings?
 

Tulius

Ad Honorem
May 2016
5,369
Portugal
#45
And why should the later discovery by Cristobal? who be more imporatant than that of the Vikings?
I am not completely sure that I understood your questions.

And if you are asking with Columbus first voyage was more important than all the voyages of the Norsemen to America, I think that is quite obvious. After the 1492 voyage the world changed, it became smaller, America and Europe became constantly connected since them, and this now continues for more than 500 years. The voyage had a huge impact in both continents as well as in Africa, in human terms and also in fauna and flora.

The Norsemen voyages to America were ephemeral, it really didn’t change much the history of the Norsemen (and much less of Europe) and it really didn’t change much of the history of America. Thus the Rubicon analogy.
 
Likes: Teslatron
Oct 2015
5,179
Matosinhos Portugal
#46
Over open, unexplored sea with no indications that there is any land in that direction?
( Portugal had a problem. It did not have enough population to occupy all the territories that discovered.

( Portugal tinha um problema. Não tinha população suficiente para ocupar todos os territórios que descobriam.


CABO DA BOA ESPERANÇA

It had kept in secret almost a century, Spain knew later, still later knew the Dutch English and French

Teve guardado em segredo quase um século,a Espanha soube mais tarde,ainda mais tarde souberam os holandeses inglesês e franceses

..........

It has the example of the whole American continent, the first ones to arrive were the Portuguese and the Spaniards, other powers appeared for the robbery, were it not for the robbery by these powers in all American continent only spoke two languages Spanish and Portuguese.
I'm talking about history.

Tem o exemplo de todo o continente americano, os primeiros a chegarem foram os portuguêses e os espanhois, outras potências apareceram para o roubo,se não fosse o roubo por essas potências em todo continente americano só falavam duas linguas espanhol e português.
Estou a falar de história.
 
Feb 2015
111
south Slavic guy
#47
I am not completely sure that I understood your questions.

And if you are asking with Columbus first voyage was more important than all the voyages of the Norsemen to America, I think that is quite obvious. After the 1492 voyage the world changed, it became smaller, America and Europe became constantly connected since them, and this now continues for more than 500 years. The voyage had a huge impact in both continents as well as in Africa, in human terms and also in fauna and flora.

The Norsemen voyages to America were ephemeral, it really didn’t change much the history of the Norsemen (and much less of Europe) and it really didn’t change much of the history of America. Thus the Rubicon analogy.
We are technically speaking here.
Vikings were the first ones, to not only discover, but to settle on the American continent.
Colombus was second.

You have to consider the time when it was made. Vikings couldn't do much impact on the Western World by its discovery simply because at that time literacy wasn't widespread, therefore people cannot understand the importance of the finding. You cannot simply draw the line and compare the impact by modern standards. I mean had the Vikings (or their successors) found America in the time of Colombus it could have been having much greater impact, maybe comparable.
It's the same as comparing a house from 1000s and 1500s and say... hey this house is way better than the other.
There must be the factor time in this thing.

Vikings/Norsemen (and their today's descendants) have the legal right to claim America. At least North America.
 

Bart Dale

Ad Honorem
Dec 2009
7,095
#48
And why should the later discovery by Cristobal? who be more imporatant than that of the Vikings?
Because the Norse discovery of the New World had no impact of the rest of the world, or even the New World.irself, and very little impact on the Norse world.itself. Columbus discoveries had a huge impact on Europe.and the rest of the world, even China. Columbus discoveries led to New World.crops coming to Europe and China, and many of those crops.are major sources of food in China, Europe and the rest of the world. That is why we commemorate Columbus and not Leif Erickson.



We
 
Feb 2015
111
south Slavic guy
#49
Because the Norse discovery of the New World had no impact of the rest of the world, or even the New World.irself, and very little impact on the Norse world.itself. Columbus discoveries had a huge impact on Europe.and the rest of the world, even China. Columbus discoveries led to New World.crops coming to Europe and China, and many of those crops.are major sources of food in China, Europe and the rest of the world. That is why we commemorate Columbus and not Leif Erickson.



We
You can celebrate whatever the fook you want, but that doesn't change the historical facts.
 
Oct 2015
5,179
Matosinhos Portugal
#50
Bart Dale said
Because the Norse discovery of the New World had no impact of the rest of the world, or even the New World.irself, and very little impact on the Norse world.itself. Columbus discoveries had a huge impact on Europe.and the rest of the world, even China. Columbus discoveries led to New World.crops coming to Europe and China, and many of those crops.are major sources of food in China, Europe and the rest of the world. That is why we commemorate Columbus and not Leif Erickson.
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Yes you are right the potato the ginger pepper Cinnamon tomato banana Coffee came from North America Christopher Columbus gave this knowledge to the world.
 

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