Do you support Russia's annexation of Crimea?

Do you support Russia's annexation of Crimea?

  • Yes

  • I would if there would be a genuinely free & fair referendum in Crimea and Russia would have won it

  • No


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Status
Closed

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
20,186
SoCal
#1
We have a thread about the Iraq War here and thus I am hoping this thread would be acceptable here as well.

Anyway, do you support Russia's annexation of Crimea?

As for me, I would have supported it if there would have been a completely free and fair referendum there. Considering that Russian troops were occupying Crimea at the time of the referendum and that Russia had a vested interest in winning this referendum, I am unsure if the actual Crimean referendum was completely free and fair. I would like a genuinely free and fair referendum to be conducted in Crimea.

As someone who generally supports national self-determination, I feel that it would be hypocritical for me not to support this principle in Crimea as well. Of course, this doesn't mean that Russia has always behaved well (for instance, violating the Budapest Memorandum after signing it), but it's not like the US and the West have always been morally righteous either.

Anyway, what are your thoughts on this?
 
Mar 2019
1,472
Kansas
#3
Anyway, do you support Russia's annexation of Crimea?
I support it assuming the referendum was all above board. It had been part of the Russian empire since the 1780s. The referendums moving the territory to the Ukraine after the breakup had a bit of a bad smell about it
 
Feb 2019
699
Serbia
#4
Since the west has done some pretty questionable things in the last 40 or so years it is only fair that Russia does something as well. As someone who is not necessarily opposed to imperialism and expansionism I support the annexation. Russia has perfect strategic and historic reasons to take it. Considering how it was transferred to Ukraine during the USSR period and what was happening with Ukraine and how they were treating Russians in their territory I think it's only right that Russia took their opportunity to take Crimea.
 

Menshevik

Ad Honorem
Dec 2012
9,245
here
#5
We have a thread about the Iraq War here and thus I am hoping this thread would be acceptable here as well.

Anyway, do you support Russia's annexation of Crimea?

As for me, I would have supported it if there would have been a completely free and fair referendum there. Considering that Russian troops were occupying Crimea at the time of the referendum and that Russia had a vested interest in winning this referendum, I am unsure if the actual Crimean referendum was completely free and fair. I would like a genuinely free and fair referendum to be conducted in Crimea.

As someone who generally supports national self-determination, I feel that it would be hypocritical for me not to support this principle in Crimea as well. Of course, this doesn't mean that Russia has always behaved well (for instance, violating the Budapest Memorandum after signing it), but it's not like the US and the West have always been morally righteous either.

Anyway, what are your thoughts on this?
I have to admit ignorance regarding Ukrainian/Crimean history... but I'm thinking that what's being proposed here, is akin to maybe having a referendum here in California? A referendum that would allow most/all/some of the state to be ceded to Mexico. So, if my analogy is apt, then I would be against such a referendum.
 
Mar 2019
1,472
Kansas
#6
I have to admit ignorance regarding Ukrainian/Crimean history... but I'm thinking that what's being proposed here, is akin to maybe having a referendum here in California? A referendum that would allow most/all/some of the state to be ceded to Mexico. So, if my analogy is apt, then I would be against such a referendum.
It kinda gets messy. The original transfer was while the Ukraine was still part of the USSR. So it is more akin to part of California being given to Nevada, then both states become independent nations after the fact.
 
Likes: Futurist

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
20,186
SoCal
#7
I have to admit ignorance regarding Ukrainian/Crimean history... but I'm thinking that what's being proposed here, is akin to maybe having a referendum here in California? A referendum that would allow most/all/some of the state to be ceded to Mexico. So, if my analogy is apt, then I would be against such a referendum.
MG1962a's response here is spot-on.

Also, as a side note, I actually would not object to the idea of a referendum in California--though it might be prudent to do it in the entire state. Conservatives should support this idea since it would be much harder for Democrats to win nationwide elections without California.
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
20,186
SoCal
#8
Since the west has done some pretty questionable things in the last 40 or so years it is only fair that Russia does something as well. As someone who is not necessarily opposed to imperialism and expansionism I support the annexation. Russia has perfect strategic and historic reasons to take it. Considering how it was transferred to Ukraine during the USSR period and what was happening with Ukraine and how they were treating Russians in their territory I think it's only right that Russia took their opportunity to take Crimea.
To my knowledge, Russians in Ukraine were not particularly oppressed. The one stupid thing that the new Ukrainian government did, though, was repealing that law that allowed Ukrainian regions to have Russian as a second official language. That was unnecessary, IMHO.

Also, Yes, given that the West violated international law in bombing Serbia in response to events in Kosovo in order to achieve what it felt was a legitimate purpose, Russia is likewise entitled to violate internal law in order to achieve what it feels is a legitimate purpose. If Crimeans genuinely want to be ruled by Russia, then they should get what they want. In addition, considering that Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych was overthrown in an unconstitutional manner, there is certainly a case to be made that Crimeans were not obligated to obey the new Ukrainian government.
 
Status
Closed