Do you think that Hitler's Austrian birth and upbringing influenced him in any ways that a German birth and upbringing would not have?

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
18,733
SoCal
#1
I have literally previously seen at least one American (a regular person somewhere on the Internet) defend the natural-born citizen requirement for the US Presidency due to the fact that Hitler was a naturalized German citizen and that if Germany would have had such a requirement, then Hitler would have never come to power in Germany. In turn, this motivated me to ask this question:

Do you think that Hitler's Austrian birth and upbringing influenced him in any ways that a German birth and upbringing would not have? I mean, some of Hitler's ideas--especially his rabid anti-Semitism* and totalitarianism--were certainly out of the German mainstream before his rise to power, but then again, these ideas weren't exactly mainstream in Austria before the Great Depression either--now were they? In turn, this makes me wonder if there is any aspect of Hitler's rule other than perhaps his willingness to risk war over the Sudetenland where his Austrian birth and upbringing influenced him in a way that a German birth and upbringing would not have.

Does anyone here have any thoughts on this?

*AFAIK, anti-Semitism was widespread in Germany even before the Great Depression, but I haven't heard of any prominent German political party before the Great Depression call for legal discrimination against Jews--let alone getting rid of Germany's Jews in whatever way possible (whether through coerced emigration or--later on--through mass murder).
 

betgo

Ad Honorem
Jul 2011
6,106
#2
His father was a customs official on the German / Austrian border and he spoke with what Germans considered a Bavarian accent. Not sure it was that different growing up on the Austrian side of 10 kilometers away on the German side.
 

Futurist

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May 2014
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#3
His father was a customs official on the German / Austrian border and he spoke with what Germans considered a Bavarian accent. Not sure it was that different growing up on the Austrian side of 10 kilometers away on the German side.
I am tempted to agree with this. I haven't heard or read anything that suggests that pre-WWI Austria (Hitler only lived in Austria until 1913, a year before the start of WWI) was any more anti-Semitic or totalitarian than pre-WWI Germany was. Am I wrong in regards to this?
 

Rodger

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,996
US
#4
I don't see how. Anti semitism was as prevalent, if not more so, In Germany than Austria. And, being born in 19th century Austria, a strongly Catholic nation, didn't seem to have any influence upon his Christian faith. Hitler was also somewhat an occultist. That would be a prevalent in parts of Germany as As Austria, if not more so. At one time Austria was part of a much more multi ethnic empire, but Hitler didn't seem to have much respect for other ethnic groups.
 
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Kotromanic

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Dec 2011
4,721
Iowa USA
#5
I can recall reading threads (certainly one, but probably multiple threads) on the subject of German-Jewish veterans of World War I that were seemingly exempted from the persecution. The thread that comes to mind, and apology that I haven't taken the time to search for it, concerned two individuals that were known to Hitler from his service in WWI. There seems to be a bit of evidence there that the radical political environment of the early '20s had more of an effect on Hitler's obsession with the Jewry than did his experiences up to age 25.
 
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Kotromanic

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Dec 2011
4,721
Iowa USA
#6
I don't see how. Anti semitism was as prevalent, if not more so, In Germany than Austria. And, being born in 19th century Austria, a strongly Catholic nation, didn't seem to have any influence upon his Christian faith. Hitler was also somewhat an occultist. That would be a prevalent in parts of Germany as As Austria, if not more so. At one time Austria was part of a much ore multi ethnic empire. but Hitler didn't seem to have much respect fr other ethnic groups.
It doesn't seem to be a stretch to judge that Hitler preferred the Hungarians to the Slavic speaking nationalities in Central and Southern Europe, though. Of course, Hungary was a specially politically privileged region of the Empire.
 
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Futurist

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May 2014
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#7
I don't see how. Anti semitism was as prevalent, if not more so, In Germany than Austria. And, being born in 19th century Austria, a strongly Catholic nation, didn't seem to have any influence upon his Christian faith. Hitler was also somewhat an occultist. That would be a prevalent in parts of Germany as As Austria, if not more so. At one time Austria was part of a much more multi ethnic empire, but Hitler didn't seem to have much respect for other ethnic groups.
Interestingly enough, Imperial Germany also had its taste of multiculturalism with its Poles, Frenchmen, Danes, Lithuanians, and Sorbs. Granted, most of these groups were small, but Poles were large enough to form a majority in parts of the east as well as a significant minority in parts of the Rhineland.

I do wonder if the atmosphere in pre-WWI Austria was more totalitarian than the atmosphere in pre-WWI Germany. Frankly, I doubt it.

I can recall reading threads (certainly one, but probably multiple threads) on the subject of German-Jewish veterans of World War I that were seemingly exempted from the persecution. The thread that comes to mind, and apology that I haven't taken the time to search for it, concerned two individuals that were known to Hitler from his service in WWI. There seems to be a bit of evidence there that the radical political environment of the early '20s had more of an effect on Hitler's obsession with the Jewry than did his experiences up to age 25.
IIRC, Brigitte Hamann argued that the Bolshevik coup in Russia in 1917 as well as Germany's WWI in 1918 and the resulting stab-in-the-back myth played a huge role in Hitler's subsequent anti-Semitism. Technically speaking, this might not be completely incompatible with what Hitler wrote in Mein Kampf--where he wrote that he first became an anti-Semite in Vienna. It's possible that Hitler was first exposed to anti-Semitic materials (literature, et cetera) in Vienna but that it only made sense to him later on as a result of developments during and after WWI.
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
18,733
SoCal
#8
It doesn't seem to be a stretch to judge that Hitler preferred the Hungarians to the Slavic speaking nationalities in Central and Southern Europe, though. Of course, Hungary was a specially politically privileged region of the Empire.
That might have been in part due to Romania's and Yugoslavia's coziness with Britain and France, though. Had these countries been willing to be in the Nazi orbit (earlier, in the case of Romania), it's possible that they would have maintained their territorial integrity or at least more of it.
 

mark87

Ad Honorem
Jan 2014
2,046
Santiago de Chile
#9
Personally I believe yes. He spent some hard years in Vienna still somewhat growing up (and failing a lot which for someone like him must have been a hard pill to swallow). I believe the root of his antisemitism was those years in Vienna even if in an embryonic stage so to speak. If he had lived in Germany at the very least he would not have been exposed to the specific cultural situation in Vienna pre 1914 which boasted a very antisemitic mayor at the time, Kurt Lueger.
 
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Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
18,733
SoCal
#10
Personally I believe yes. He spent some hard years in Vienna still somewhat growing up (and failing a lot which for someone like him must have been a hard pill to swallow). I believe the root of his antisemitism was those years in Vienna even if in an embryonic stage so to speak. If he had lived in Germany at the very least he would not have been exposed to the specific cultural situation in Vienna pre 1914 which boasted a very antisemitic mayor at the time, Kurt Lueger.
To be fair, though, pre-WWI Germany also had some anti-Semitism; for instance, here's a proto-Nazi book by German nationalist Heinrich Class from 1912:

An excerpt from a proto-Nazi book from 1912
 
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