European Union - Good idea or not?

Aug 2008
30
Copenhagen, Denmark
I know one thing for certain. Britain will never surrender anything to the EU. Anti- EU sentiment in the country is very strong. The EU is deeply unpopular. Anything that comes from the EU is treated with deep suspicion, bordering on xenophobia.

There will never be a united states of europe. Individual countries will never give up the power to control themsevelves. No country will trust another enough to do that.

Sad, but true.
Nothing to add! Very well said!
 

galteeman

Ad Honorem
Apr 2008
2,198
Sodom and Begorrah
eventually there will be a united world if you follow the pattern of human organisation so far.
originally we were all living in bands of hunter gatherers, then tribes, then kingdoms, then states. the entities have gotten bigger as time goes by.
China for example has long been unified even though originally the inhabitants were once as diverse as the europeans of today.
Naturally along the way there are break ups of large states such as the fall of empires like Rome etc., but by and large we are moving in the direction of unifying different groups.
In the past the unity of diverse groups was achieved by force so mabye that is what will eventually have to happen again.
 
Aug 2008
599
eventually there will be a united world if you follow the pattern of human organisation so far.
originally we were all living in bands of hunter gatherers, then tribes, then kingdoms, then states. the entities have gotten bigger as time goes by.
China for example has long been unified even though originally the inhabitants were once as diverse as the europeans of today.
Naturally along the way there are break ups of large states such as the fall of empires like Rome etc., but by and large we are moving in the direction of unifying different groups.
In the past the unity of diverse groups was achieved by force so mabye that is what will eventually have to happen again.
i like your thinking, galteeman, but fear that tribes/states/groups require the existence of other tribes/states etc. without that good old fear of 'other', individualism comes to the fore and tribalism breaks down. i suspect that rival groups would then appear and it would all start over again.
 

galteeman

Ad Honorem
Apr 2008
2,198
Sodom and Begorrah
Damned individualism eh.
Is it our greatest strength or our greatest weakness?:rolleyes:
 
Oct 2008
13
It's ironic that most European countries feel that their independence is threatened by the EU, as most Irish historians feel that our country didn't achieve real economic independence from Britain until we joined. Admittedly, some improvements like an elected EU President and an electoral college similar to the American system would be preferable, but despite the Lisbon result, most Irish people do approve of the EU. Most hardcore opponents tend to be either rightwing connservatives or extreme nationalists, that unrepresentative 20% managing to scare an additional 30% of undecideds into voting No.
 
Oct 2008
40
... and the people of Europe still can't forget what happened in WW2, as it was only a lifetime ago (Think about it, 60 years...not that long), the atrocities that each side committed, people are still bitter, and are not willing to forgive....
It is truth, we can see many examples (e.g. Beneš decrees - valid or not?), but Europe must live with it, and nobody says - you are German, so bye bye.

Personally, WW2, West x East,... it is for me history, I was born after the Velvet Revolution, after the fall of Berlin Wall, I was small during the war in Balcan (I don't remember it) and many of my peers have similar opinion - it was important, but it is history.

I'm proud of beeing member of the EU. the election to Europian parliament will be my first election.
 
I know one thing for certain. Britain will never surrender anything to the EU. Anti- EU sentiment in the country is very strong. The EU is deeply unpopular. Anything that comes from the EU is treated with deep suspicion, bordering on xenophobia.

There will never be a united states of europe. Individual countries will never give up the power to control themsevelves. No country will trust another enough to do that.

Sad, but true.
I agree that there won't be a united states of europe, not for a while anyway! but the UK and Ireland are like it or not signing up for the EU treaty. They plan to implement all the treaty ideas through stealth. So the treaty vote was meaningless really. Sad to say for a supposedly democratic union the EU dictates an awful lot!!