Game of Thrones (SPOILERS)

Maki

Ad Honorem
Jan 2017
2,279
Republika Srpska
Yes, but the half-implied half-said assumption of Umber's speech is that NOW, they would only bow down to a "Southron" ruler/claimant if they have a dragon (that is to say, an "unbeatable weapon"), which is the case at present.
I don't see it. Greatjon Umber merely gave a justification for Northern independence: "Well, we actually swore fealty to the Targaryens and they are gone", while conveniently forgetting to mention that they also swore an oath to Robert Baratheon and his family. Thing is, we were actually given hints that weirwood arrows can harm the dragons. King Torrhen's bastard brother Brandon Snow attempted to persuade the king to allow him to try to kill Aegon's dragons. And it should be noted that not everyone in the North accepted Targaryen overlordship, those unhappy left Westeros and actually founded a sellsword company in Essos (Company of the Rose). Torrhen himself doesn't have the best reputation, after all his nickname is the King who Knelt, not the Wise King or the King that saved the North.
 
Sep 2010
10,779
Kragujevac,Serbia
I don't see it. Greatjon Umber merely gave a justification for Northern independence: "Well, we actually swore fealty to the Targaryens and they are gone", while conveniently forgetting to mention that they also swore an oath to Robert Baratheon and his family. Thing is, we were actually given hints that weirwood arrows can harm the dragons. King Torrhen's bastard brother Brandon Snow attempted to persuade the king to allow him to try to kill Aegon's dragons. And it should be noted that not everyone in the North accepted Targaryen overlordship, those unhappy left Westeros and actually founded a sellsword company in Essos (Company of the Rose). Torrhen himself doesn't have the best reputation, after all his nickname is the King who Knelt, not the Wise King or the King that saved the North.
All of those things (weirwood arrows, sellsword company and Torrhen's reputation) are irrelevant (meaning, nonexistent) for the show, as is the fact that they swore an oath to Robert Baratheon, to a current political situation/plot in the North.

And you are wrong about Umber' speech. Implication that the main factor in acknowledging Targaryen supremacy are dragons (which, again, as far as the show goes, you should read as "unbeatable weapons against everything short of White Walkers") is pretty clear. Of course, that ignores why they stayed loyal to Iron Throne even after dragons disappeared, but nobody has ever accused northern lords or their arguments (including Greatjon's) of foolproof logic and/or consistency. The simple fact of the matter is that they have just not always been as ardent for independence as they like to pretend now.
 
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Maki

Ad Honorem
Jan 2017
2,279
Republika Srpska
Sure, the North didn't declare independence after the dragons disappeared, but it seems that in the aftermath of the Dance of Dragons, the Starks actually gained some influence in King's Landing. Lord Cregan Stark became Hand of the King and then Lord Torrhen Manderly, who was sworn to the Starks, also became the Hand. It wouldn't make sense to secede now when you can actually influence the entire realm. Later, Cregan's heir Rickon would fight alongside the Young Dragon and would die in Dorne. It seems this caused turmoil in the North, and we know about the turmoil during the time of the She-Wolves. So, it seems that the North was relatively unstable during much of Targaryen rule. This might explain why they didn't declare independence.

Though, of course, you are right, this never happened in the show, so...
 

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