Game of Thrones (SPOILERS)

Mar 2012
407
The North has always been seprate from the other Kingdoms, the only reason why it was apart of the Seven Kingdoms was the Targaryen Dragons(Who were supposedly bigger than Dany's eek), so it was probably of little consequence in the larger scheme of things to let Sansa have its independence. I mean with the Lannister (and Id assume Royal) Army annihilated I doubt Bran has any real chance of conquering or posing a threat to Sansa.

North can't exercise it's influence in south, it is too remote and too weak especially after all fighting. I think that they lost at least half of their able bodied men and probably a little lower percentage of all population. Sansa is also well rooted into northern society and well supported.

Let's compare her position to position of other lords of 7 realms:

Royal lands: insignificant cripple passive king who is uncapable of anything. He will be staring and mumbling in elvish tongue and won't be thrown into a gutter because of others in a council.
The Reach: Bronn who? Not meaning that he is uncapable but what is his support?
The Vale: Idiotic kid, a puppet to anyone with five minutes of spare time.
Stormlands: Gendry who? Same as Bronn.
West: Tyrion the Dwarf, smart but he killed his father and he doesn't really impose respect but still one of abler to hold his possessions. After cutting off of few most disrespectful heads, marrying and producing a son in stable hold of family lands, without all three prerequisites shaky shaky.
Riverlands: Edmure of Jails in not really stable health. Somehow he will pull it if not dying very soon because of health problems. Is he having children?
Iron Islands: Yara. Pretty similar to Tyrion's position (as a woman she does not command respect to her macho seafaring cutthroat society) with same prerequisites to get more stable hold.
Dorne: Who?

Sansa is in best position of all rulers so her choice for independence is a logical one.
 
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Mar 2012
407
The idea of "Rip offs" is kinda annoying, everyone rips of someone. Im not a fan of GRRM but his writing is what made GoT successful, D&D just proved how sloppy they are without GRRM to guide them.
 
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Apr 2018
787
India
North can't exercise it's influence in south, it is too remote and too weak especially after all fighting. I think that they lost at least half of their able bodied men and probably a little lower percentage of all population. Sansa is also well rooted into northern society and well supported.

Let's compare her position to position of other lords of 7 realms:

Royal lands: insignificant cripple passive king who is uncapable of anything. He will be staring and mumbling in elvish tongue and won't be thrown into a gutter because of others in a council.
The Reach: Bronn who? Not meaning that he is uncapable but what is his support?
The Vale: Idiotic kid, a puppet to anyone with five minutes of spare time.
Stormlands: Gendry who? Same as Bronn.
West: Tyrion the Dwarf, smart but he killed his father and he doesn't really impose respect but still one of abler to hold his possessions. After cutting off of few most disrespectful heads, marrying and producing a son in stable hold of family lands, without all three prerequisites shaky shaky.
Riverlands: Edmure of Jails in not really stable health. Somehow he will pull it if not dying very soon because of health problems. Is he having children?
Iron Islands: Yara. Pretty similar to Tyrion's position (as a woman she does not command respect to her macho seafaring cutthroat society) with same prerequisites to get more stable hold.
Dorne: Who?

Sansa is in best position of all rulers so her choice for independence is a logical one.
Actually the Ironborn like Yara. It so happens that being cuttthroats themselves, they like the ultimate disgusting one more than the potentially good one.
 
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Oct 2011
554
Croatia
Roman empire was not a Feudal society, like Westeros. Roman civilization was built on slave labour. By the late Republican era, slavery had become a vital economic pillar in the wealth of Rome, as well as a very significant part of Roman society.
Depends on the period. Slavery wasn't much of a thing for most of Empire's history, specifically since Diocletian's introduction of colonage, and especially in period of 7th to 11th centuries, the Empire was heavily dependant on a strong class of small landowners for its social and military structure. That being said, it is true that it only became feudal state after Komnenian reforms, which led to significant increase in political instability.

the wights were a rip off of orcs and the white walkers were a rip off of saruman soldiers
Actually, no. Showmakers Dumb & Dumber did rip off Lord of the Rings, and Martin was definitely *ahem* inspired by it, but inspirations of both wights and white walkers exist in actual mythology, no need to rip them off from Tolkien.

White Walkers were apparently inspired by Sidhe:
The mythology behind Game of Thrones White Walkers
Game of Thrones as Myth: The Roots of the White Walkers
 

aggienation

Ad Honorem
Jul 2016
9,813
USA
And why should anyone simply accept that the North is independent and not seek independence for themselves?
Because that's how D&D wrote it.

Next thing, you'll be doubting why they chose a king without any hopes of ever having an offspring, without any loyal army to help hold the kingdom together, who didn't even contribute to winning the war against the Night King or Cercei in the first place, as the logical choice for a new king to fix a broken land, savaged by a brutal civil war.

"Some fans are impossible to please" - D&D
 
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macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,198
Slovenia, EU
Actually the Ironborn like Yara. It so happens that being cuttthroats themselves, they like the ultimate disgusting one more than the potentially good one.
Yes, she was one of them and she did not kill her father. But she still needs a firm holding with establishing of succession line. Her people are in my opinion also more troublesome than Tyrion's subjects.
 
Sep 2016
1,370
Georgia
Slavery wasn't much of a thing for most of Empire's history, specifically since Diocletian's introduction of colonage, and especially in period of 7th to 11th centuries, the Empire was heavily dependant on a strong class of small landowners for its social and military structure. That being said, it is true that it only became feudal state after Komnenian reforms, which led to significant increase in political instability.
I didn't include period of Byzantine empire.

My point was more about Roman Republic and first centuries of Roman Empire.
 
Apr 2018
787
India
Depends on the period. Slavery wasn't much of a thing for most of Empire's history, specifically since Diocletian's introduction of colonage, and especially in period of 7th to 11th centuries, the Empire was heavily dependant on a strong class of small landowners for its social and military structure. That being said, it is true that it only became feudal state after Komnenian reforms, which led to significant increase in political instability.



Actually, no. Showmakers Dumb & Dumber did rip off Lord of the Rings, and Martin was definitely *ahem* inspired by it, but inspirations of both wights and white walkers exist in actual mythology, no need to rip them off from Tolkien.

White Walkers were apparently inspired by Sidhe:
The mythology behind Game of Thrones White Walkers
Game of Thrones as Myth: The Roots of the White Walkers
Tolkein and Martin cannot actually be compared. Tolkein was a poet and linguist. His mastery was in turning a simple and basic work of fantasy into a masterpiece by the use words alone. He was a wordsmith. Also Tolkein's work was a plain good vs evil saga where evil was vanquished and good prevailed. However few people have ever depicted an entity as an embodiment of Fascism so beautifully like Tolkein did with Sauron. Also very few characters of legendarium actually change over time without any supernatural cause and even these are quite simplistic. Boromir, Thorin etc are a few to name. Another feather on Tolkein's cap is that when he wrote LoTR, Hobbit and Silmarillion, the genre was literally nonexistent. One has to appreciate the gorgantuan effort of imagination he had to put in while writing such an epic work.

Martin on the other hand is an adept worldbuilder. It's true that he had a lot of material to take inspiration from but he took it to a whole level by introducing the complexities of real life people into a work of fantasy. I sometimes wonder what realists like Turgenev or Dostoevsky would have said about Martin's work. Martin's world is like a mirror image of the real world. Forget the dragons and white walkers/others, they are just tools to build the story. The real story is all about human psychology. Tolkein was a romantic, Martin is a realist. It just happens that both work with the same genre of literature.

In order to fully appreciate Tolkein one has to take his knowledge of the language and to some extent, linguistics to a different level and every second put into that effort will be worth it. On the other hand Martin's work is for everyone where he guides the reader through his complex world. Both are marvellous but in very different ways.

That said, it's a good thing that Peter Jackson stuck to the books while these two iditots screwed it all up like rank amateurs in the end. I don't mind GRRM putting a Stoneman from Valyria on the Iron Throne but is that a way to execute the ending of an epic work of such fame? Shame, shame, shame, shame...........!!!
 
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