Game of Thrones (SPOILERS)

nuclearguy165

Ad Honorem
Nov 2011
4,843
Ohio, USA
That scene with the small council...it looked like it was from a sitcom, something like Everybody loves Raymond. Pathetic.
That's why this episode is fun for all the wrong reasons. Actually, this applies to the season as a whole, come to think of it.
 
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Maki

Ad Honorem
Jan 2017
3,762
Republika Srpska
As I said, Robb never asked Jaime to bend the knee because Jaime was from the Westerlands, Robb didn't claim the Westerlands.
 
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aggienation

Ad Honorem
Jul 2016
9,813
USA
It would only be treason if Danaerys was the Queen of Westeros, but she was just a claimant. Henry Tudor tried this same nonsense, trying to date his reign to the day before the Battle of Bosworth so that he could treat anyone who had fought for the previous king as traitors. Henry's own supporters wouldn't let him get away with it.
Oh Good Lord. She is a claimant, who captured him in battle. As far as she is considered, she's queen. The Tarly family are thus her vassals. She gave him the option of pledging his allegiance. He refused. In her eyes, and those who are loyal to her, he is a legit traitor, and thus subject to execution.

Did Jamie swear allegiance to House Stark when he was captured? Did Robb Stark demand that Jaime bend the knee or die? Did Theon swear allegiance to House Bolton when he was captured? Did Roose or Ramsey Bolton demand that Theon bend the knee or die? Did Edmure Tully swear allegiance to House Frey when he was captured? Did Walder Frey demand that Edmure bend the knee or die?

Then why do you think Danaerys had any right to demand that Randyll Tarley bend the knee or die?
This is why you have so much problem understanding this, you don't know how feudalism works.

Jaimie doesn't need to swear loyalty to House Stark because the Lannisters are not vassals of the Starks. He is simply their prisoner. But being the son of Tywin, he's of great value as a hostage. But why would they want him to swear fealty? He's not supposed to be loyal to them.

Theon is likewise not a vassal of the Boltons, just a prisoner. He was a Greyjoy, and at that point technically a prince of the Iron Islands, as their king declared independence. He invaded the North and took Winterfell. The Bolton family took it back, and they being the acting Wardens of the North, were the supreme power at the time, as Robb was dead, Sansa was still not involved in Northern politics, and Jon Snow was still in the Night's Watch. So what is the relationship between Theon or other Greyjoys and the Boltons? Nothing. He's purely prisoner, but one with almost no value. But because Ramsey was a psychopath, he got his rocks off torturing Theon and making him his bitch.

Edmure Tully is the rightful Lord of House Frey, who is his legitimate vassal. After Hoster Tully died Frey bent the knee to his son, Edmure. So at that point, from the perspective of House Stark, who is the King of the North, House Tully swore fealty to him, and thus all under House Tully (including House Frey) are sworn to King Robb too. Which is why the Red Wedding was outrageous. Frey not only broke his oath of loyalty to Robb Stark, who he had also bent the knee to, but also his lord, whose wedding it was, who was then taken prisoner during, so double betrayal. Triple betrayal, if you count that it was done after Frey had offered bread and salt to his guests, and thus was obligated to protect them, according to local custom.

Meanwhile, the Tarly family are the vassals of House Tyrell, Wardens of the South and Lords of Highgarden. Which is why it makes no sense that Randyl Tarly teams up with the people who murdered his Liege lord. Later in the show, the Tyrell family under control of Olenna Tyrell (who was not the ruling lady, someone else would be in power, but we'll skip ) allied themselves with Daenarys, which means Lord Tarly, who is still the vassal of the Tyrells is also the vassal of Daenarys. If he claims otherwise, he is a traitor. And thus subject to execution as such.

If one doesn't actually understand feudal history, they're going to have issues understanding Game of Thrones. Just like the showrunners, who also had no clue how feudalism works.
 
Sep 2016
1,330
Georgia
Do you know comics written by Alejandro Jodorowsky and drawn by Moebius and others? Sci/fi with elements of mythology, occult, history.
Why do you need them, when we already have ,, Dune '' for that ?

Leto II Atreides has so many similarities to Bran Stark. Only Leto is much more interesting character.
 
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aggienation

Ad Honorem
Jul 2016
9,813
USA
Why do you need them, when we already have ,, Dune '' for that ?

Leto II Atreides has so many similarities to Bran Stark. Only Leto is much more interesting character.
An interesting similarity in terms of prescience. However, Leto the God Emperor was essentially an immortal, while Bran is not.
 
Aug 2014
1,273
pakistan
the wights were a rip off of orcs and the white walkers were a rip off of saruman soldiers
Orcs were not undead mindless creatures like wights, and saruman's soldiers were also orcs. And there is no evil lord like Sauron in ASOIF. Night king being the leader of white walkers, is purely a show creation.
 
Aug 2014
1,273
pakistan
This petition , which is signed by 1.3 million so far, is surely going to embarrass David Benioff and D.B. Weiss and HBO. I hope HBO will be careful about upcoming prequel and will hire quality writers for it.
 
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macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,176
Slovenia, EU
Oh Good Lord. She is a claimant, who captured him in battle. As far as she is considered, she's queen. The Tarly family are thus her vassals. She gave him the option of pledging his allegiance. He refused. In her eyes, and those who are loyal to her, he is a legit traitor, and thus subject to execution.



This is why you have so much problem understanding this, you don't know how feudalism works.

Jaimie doesn't need to swear loyalty to House Stark because the Lannisters are not vassals of the Starks. He is simply their prisoner. But being the son of Tywin, he's of great value as a hostage. But why would they want him to swear fealty? He's not supposed to be loyal to them.

Theon is likewise not a vassal of the Boltons, just a prisoner. He was a Greyjoy, and at that point technically a prince of the Iron Islands, as their king declared independence. He invaded the North and took Winterfell. The Bolton family took it back, and they being the acting Wardens of the North, were the supreme power at the time, as Robb was dead, Sansa was still not involved in Northern politics, and Jon Snow was still in the Night's Watch. So what is the relationship between Theon or other Greyjoys and the Boltons? Nothing. He's purely prisoner, but one with almost no value. But because Ramsey was a psychopath, he got his rocks off torturing Theon and making him his bitch.

Edmure Tully is the rightful Lord of House Frey, who is his legitimate vassal. After Hoster Tully died Frey bent the knee to his son, Edmure. So at that point, from the perspective of House Stark, who is the King of the North, House Tully swore fealty to him, and thus all under House Tully (including House Frey) are sworn to King Robb too. Which is why the Red Wedding was outrageous. Frey not only broke his oath of loyalty to Robb Stark, who he had also bent the knee to, but also his lord, whose wedding it was, who was then taken prisoner during, so double betrayal. Triple betrayal, if you count that it was done after Frey had offered bread and salt to his guests, and thus was obligated to protect them, according to local custom.

Meanwhile, the Tarly family are the vassals of House Tyrell, Wardens of the South and Lords of Highgarden. Which is why it makes no sense that Randyl Tarly teams up with the people who murdered his Liege lord. Later in the show, the Tyrell family under control of Olenna Tyrell (who was not the ruling lady, someone else would be in power, but we'll skip ) allied themselves with Daenarys, which means Lord Tarly, who is still the vassal of the Tyrells is also the vassal of Daenarys. If he claims otherwise, he is a traitor. And thus subject to execution as such.

If one doesn't actually understand feudal history, they're going to have issues understanding Game of Thrones. Just like the showrunners, who also had no clue how feudalism works.
She is only a self proclaimed claimant and nothing more. She went through no formal procedure of acquiring a throne. Nobody from Westeros needs to kneel before her because she is nobody's lord, only a prisoners killing invader. Formal procedures as crowning by highest lords and religious authorities on a specific place is there to establish a link to the realm, a self proclamation is not enough. Also vassals need to do a formal submission, usually around the crowning and usually they also sign a document.

"As far as she is considered, she's queen" is not an argument because anyone can also claim to be the Napoleon.

You are stubborn as hell with repeating your nonsense.
 
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