Had China democratized in 1989, what would the last 30 years have looked like for China?


Ad Honorem
Sep 2011
Very simply by listening to what people want. The CCP is expert in conducting research, short and long-term studies. It is a party of 80+ million, and they feed up information on what what people want, how they feel, etc...

The government use the people's needs and wants as research data and consultation on what to do. It does a very good in using that information in realising Chinese aspirations and national goals. We could see the results by looking at China's track record and high approval for the CCP.

I'd recommend:

The China Model: Political Meritocracy and the Limits of Democracy by Daniel A. Bell
And when people want something that the CCP doesn't?

And when a local community or a minority wants something the majority doesn't want, and the CCP doesn't want? (We are looking at two independent object lessons of how China handles this at the very moment.)

And that's not even entering into the brave new world of data driven AI dependent social technologies – the potential of being able to "write the music" that makes the public move unbeknownst to itself why.

The European experience of discussing things as simple as building high-speed railroads with Chinese contractors, with huge experience of doing it in China, constantly brings home the cognitive dissonance when having to explain to the Chinese that in Europe you can't just take the land and move the people at will. They have not just rights but actual political influence. The problems never boil down to engineering, it's all about politics.

Even talking about how Chinese public opinion might find expression is redundant since the Chinese public don't even enjoy the rule of law.
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Likes: Futurist
Feb 2011
For the most part, people want to be relocated because they receive compensation from the government many times above and beyond the value of their property. That's why a common tactic among Chinese people is to make 'upgrades' to their property right before government inspection for confiscation, because they know the cost of the upgrade is dwarfed by the amount of extra money the government would pay them due to the higher property value from said upgrade. There are many poor families who got rich in the space of one day because of land expropriation. I should know, I'm friends with some of them. There's even a term for people who absolutely refuse to move in order to pressure the government to 'up' the compensation, it's called a 'nail house':

So I heavily question whatever source of information you used to claim that Chinese developers in Europe have the illusion that they could just force Europeans to relocate however they want. If true, they must think very badly of Europe.

If all else fails, sue the Chinese government, you can see people doing that over expropriation in real time: http://tingshen.court.gov.cn/search/common?keywords=征收&
^That website shows videos of entire Chinese court cases, I put in "expropriation" in the search menu.
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Ad Honorem
Apr 2015
If India would have adopted Communism, it might have eventually broken up just like the USSR did.
In India we take extreme pride in our ethno-regional identity and never saw it as hindrance towards our national identity of our ancient nation.

Compared that communism try to suppress the such ethano regional and nationalism is groomed for communist ideology and not for a sense of common history. One of such classic example was Yugoslavia. When communism was gone people were directionless in entire Eastern Europe.
Likes: Futurist
Mar 2012
The PRC focuses plenty on narrating a common history between ethnic minorities and the Han; so much so that it is often becoming a political issue. The western media focus too much on more rebellious groups such as Tibetans or Uighurs and ignores the fact that the vast majority of China's 55 recognized ethnic minorities, including the three most populous ones, the Hui, Zhuang, and Manchu are fully integrated into the mainstream society. Overall I consider the PRC ethnic policies (in terms of making minorities feel a sense of Chinese nationalism) a success, not a failure.

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